BigGameHoundsmen.com

Hey Everyone,
Im just gettting into and learning as much as I can about hunting Hogs with Dogs and Im wondering if you experienced hunters could answer some questions for me? I have a tonne im sure you guys have heard a million times but hopefully you can bare with me.

-First thing im wondering about is breed, I live in Alberta Canada and there isnt anyone that I know of up here thats hog hunting with dogs as most of the hogs I know of up here are ones that have gotten loose from high fence hunt areas and wild hog farms, there fore there in a concentrated approx 100 sq. mile area up here. I know of some pit bull breeders etc but no one with broke dogs. Lots of the Cat hunters up here are telling me Plott's might be the way to go?

-Secondly does a guy always want catch dogs and trailing dogs? Can you have dogs that will do both?

-From what guys have been telling me the best way for me to get going would be to get a broke dog or two then try and get some yound ones started with them? Whats your thoughts on that?

-How many dogs should a guy be running?

-Whats a guy gonna pay for a good broke dog? Or well bred or started pup?

Well thats my main question for now and I sure appreciate any one that could help answer these and provide any other info they figure would help me out. Thanks alot guys

houndcrzy: What part of Alberta are you in??
Any other type of critters in the area you will be hunting??
I would go with leopards ,just personal preference
or catahola's

Houndcrzy,

Hope this helps, just remember, my advice is probably worth about what it cost you, but if you don’t think this helps, don’t try to argue that I owe you for taking the time to read it, cause I won’t pay.LOL



"The majority of the country I would be hunting is smaller blocks like a 1/2 mile squares"

For hunting this type acreages I think that silent running very aggressive, gritty dogs like catahoula cur or black mouthed curs are best. For hunting these small parcels you will need a pretty short range dog, so be careful what line of curs you get, some of them will go yonder.

"but there is some area that is say up to 6 or 8 sqaure miles of the roughest nastiest tangled up crap willows goin. I'd say theres a few hundred hogs within 20 minute drive of the house, and yes they are of russian decent and it seems all they do is run! "

You are still talking about pretty small tracts of land here, 8 square miles is only 5000 acres. I'd still go with a silent cur, or maybe a cur/hound cross as long as it was silent. On hard running hogs, silent dogs will shorten your races a bunch because the hogs won't hear them coming as much and won't get as big a head start. 5000 acres is large enough that you will probably want a dog with a little more range than a short range dog has, but a medium range dog can still get you into trouble. Brains, agility, quickness, and small size is what is going to keep your dogs alive in the thick stuff. I would stay away from dogs weighing over 50 lbs and I think 35 to 40 is ideal. That is small enough to be quick, yet big enough to muscle a hog some if things go bad wrong.

"Will Plotts grab and hold a hog? I dont care about getting right ahold of them I just want them to bay'em up till I can get there and shoot them."

Yes, plotts will get it done. As 12 guage said, all the hound breeds can do it if you get the right dog out of the right line. My opinion is that you will not have to go through as many plotts to find one that works for you as you would some of the other breeds, but you will still need to select your dogs carefully to avoid some of the lines that are not as good on hogs. Although I have said, and I believe, that all the hound breeds can catch hogs, I must admit a slight preference for plotts, especially when crossed with a catahoula, but that is just a personal preferance. I have seen labs and pointers that were good hog dogs, but I wouldn’t buy one of them expecting them to work out.

“Lots of the Cat hunters up here are telling me Plott's might be the way to go?”

Plotts can catch the hogs for you, but I think that they, or any of the hound breeds, will have way too much range for the size tracts that you are talking about. Unless you can get permission from several contiguous landowners that add up to 20 or 30 thousand acres I would not recommend a full blodded hound. Where I hunt I have permission on over 60 thousand acres, and I still sometimes have to call off the dogs before they get on property I don’t have permission to hunt.

"Some guys probly dont think thats as much fun but thats what I want for now."

That depends on your definition of fun. In the thick stuff trying to get a shot can be, not necessarily will be, but can be, more dangerous than using a catch dog. I use a gun much more than I use a catch dog, and I have shot several hogs that were literally within two feet of me before I could see them to shoot them. If your idea of fun is getting an adreanline jolt, then it doesn't get much more fun than that. If I remember correctly, you are not allowed to hunt with a pistol in Canada, so you will need a short barrelled, very fast handling rifle with a considerable thump. There are a lot of calibers that will work, but I reccommend at least a .35 or larger. I have killed a lot of hogs with a 30-30, but I prefer something a little bigger when getting in real close. Having said all that, the same thing can happen when using a catch dog, but if you have good catch dogs, it is much more rare.

"Whats the difference between a strike dog and a catch dog? "

A strike dog is a dog that you release to strike, trail up, and bay a hog. A catch dog is usually led untill close to the bay, then released to catch the hog, preferably on the head. You follow the catch dog in and catch the hog by the back legs, then you can either tie him up or stick him. If you are planning on shooting, you don't need a catch dog.

“-Secondly does a guy always want catch dogs and trailing dogs? Can you have dogs that will do both?”

Yes, you can have dogs that will do both, some people call them running catch dogs. My experience has been that running catch dogs have much larger vet bills and shorter life expectancies. However, I do believe that a good bay dog should catch when the catch dog catches. He should also catch if and when the hog gets after you, and he should also catch if you tell him to, but not untill you tell him to.

“-From what guys have been telling me the best way for me to get going would be to get a broke dog or two then try and get some yound ones started with them? Whats your thoughts on that?”

I agree, however, if that is not an option, it is usually not to difficult to trap a wild hog and get a pup going, once he gets to working a hog in a pen pretty good, quit working him on the penned hog and take him to the woods. If your dog is bred right, he will want to hunt, it is just a matter of encouraging him on hogs and breaking him off everything you don’t want him to hunt.

“-How many dogs should a guy be running?”

That’s a question that will probably get as many different answers as there are people that post an answer. I like to run 2 finished dogs, one well started dog, and one young “starting” dog. However, if I am going after a particular hog that I know is extra tough, I just use 3 finished dogs.

“-Whats a guy gonna pay for a good broke dog? Or well bred or started pup?”

That is kind of a tricky question. It has a lot to do with a persons definition of good, and their definition of broke. This is how I describe my well started dogs: They can catch their own hog, they have not run trash in at least a year, you can call them off a bay, and they will catch on command. A dog I described that way would cost you 2500 from me(I don’t currently have any for sale). I have seen dogs described as finished that were priced at 1500, I went and hunted with them and didn’t buy them.

To me, a just started dog has been on at least 10 hogs, shows a willingness to listen when I tell him something, and has shown enough ability on the trail and at the bay that I belive he will make a good dog. I would sell a dog like that for 1000 to 2000 dollars (I don’t currently have any of them for sale either).

I sell pups out of proven crosses for 500 dollars. A proven cross is when both parents are finished dogs, and at least 90 percent of all previous crosses between these two parents lived long enough to be finished dogs (I don’t currently have any of them for sale either).


I give away extra pups out of unproven crosses on the condition that you let me know how they turn out (I do have two of these).

These prices are just what I do, I am sure that if you shop around you will probably find lots of dogs a lot cheaper. I do not raise pups for the purpose of selling them and the vast majority of dogs I have sold have been sold to people that hunted with me and wanted one of my dogs. I used to say that I do not sell finished dogs, but one time someone really wanted one and he pulled out his checkbook and wrote a big enough number on it to prove that I can be convinced.

I think that is pretty much all your questions. Remember that this is all just my opinion, most people on here will probably disagree with me.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes.


Bill A. Brockman

holding is what the catch dog does. if you're going to shoot them you don't need a catchdog it only makes a safe shot harder. a dog does have to be hard enough to pull up a running hog and most bear & cat bred dogs aren't because of the high vet bills that go with it. coon & fox hounds would be better hounds for hogs. either way you want speed & bottom. bull crosses (w/ cur or hound) bring a lot to the table and run solo are dynamite but w/ other dogs they can be bay busters.

Bob Im in North Central AB. As to what other kinds of animals we have here there's deer, elk and moose, lots of bears coyotes and wolves, we also have Lynx and Couger but probly not in the numbers as many as some places. However theres a fellow here that has treed 10 already this month so their there for sure if a guy looks hard enough.

Bill your info and answers helps tremendously and I REALLY appreciate you taking the time to answer all those questions to that extent. im sure you guys get tired of another "wanna be" hog hunter so I thank you for your time.

QUOTE:"For hunting this type acreages I think that silent running very aggressive, gritty dogs like catahoula cur or black mouthed curs are best. For hunting these small parcels you will need a pretty short range dog, so be careful what line of curs you get, some of them will go yonder.


I agree with you in that the short to medium range dogs sound best for what im gonna get up too with em. About anyone will more then welcome you to come kill hogs on there land around here as they tear the crops up pretty good, but at the same time I would rather some dogs that might be a little easier to keep track of as opposed to finding them 2 counties away in with someones cows or something. There is some Catahoula breeders up here and some that breed blue ticks etc. Should I start looking for some cross bred cur dogs to start or forget that and go right to someone that raises dogs to hunt pigs with exclusively. These guys up here dont breed dogs specifically to hunt hogs that im aware of. The reason I say that is cause no one hunts hogs with dogs up here.....yet lol. I guess what im trying to say is in your opinion, keeping cost etc. in mind, do I have much hope if I got some dogs that weren't bred and raised to hunt hogs and tried to start them? Would I be better off to just get to it and get some dogs from the states and go from there? Im not livin in a garbage bin or anything but im not really made of money either so cost is a factor, although I do realize this probly isnt going to be cheap any way you shake it.

What I would like to end up with....some day. Is a set of "running catch dogs" as you explained and a specific catch dog further down the line if we want to get into stickin some or tieing a few up. Maybe I would be best to get a good broke dog or 2 from down there and then try and find some good pups up here to start along with them. I've raised and trained horses, buckin bulls, sled dogs etc. so I have some experience with animals and convincing them that what you want them to do is a good idea, so maybe I have a shot at getting some young'ns goin on my own with the help of some good broke ones?

Bill again I really appreciate all your time I learned more from reading the answers you wrote me then I have in the last week snooping around the net! I hope you and others will continue to lend your valuable advice!
Thanks alot guys!

Houndcrzy,

You do NOT need dogs bred specifically for hunting hogs. In fact, I have had more success with catahoulas bred for working livestock than I have with catahoulas bred just for hogs. I think that it is because most people breeding for stock dogs put more emphasis on brains and handle than most hog hunters, and that is where I also put a lot of emphasis. I would, however, stay a long way AWAY from catahoulas, or any line in any other breed, that have been bred for the show.

As far as coonhound vs big game hound, I have to disagree with pop on that one. I personally prefer big game bred hounds to coon hound. My experience has been that dogs bred for bear have just as much or more grit than coon hounds, but that neither coon or big game bred hounds will put as many holes in a bear hide while the bear is still alive and live to tell the tale as a catahoula will. This differing experience than pop has had may be just a regional difference, or it may be personal preference. If I were going to get some dogs from pops part of the country, I would listen to what he says about the dogs in that area.

If I were going to start from scratch, and had some experience training animals, I would get two catahoula females and two plott males(personal preference). If I could afford what I considered to be well started dogs, thats what I would get. If I could only afford 2 well started dogs, I would get 2 started catahoulas and two plott pups. If I could only afford pups, I would not feel handicapped, it would just be 8 to 10 months longer before I could start catching hogs. Assuming I wanted to raise my own replacements(and I would) as soon as I had all the dogs working up near what I thought was their potential I would pick out what I thought was the very best, and breed it to the best of the opposite gender and other breed. For example, if my best dog was a catahoula male, I would breed him to a plott female. If all the dogs were good dogs, the next year I would breed the other plott to the other catahoula. At that point you would have the basis for starting you own line of plott/catahoula crosses by selective linebreeding and hard culling. One other note on getting your first hog dogs, I would rather pay 500 for a well bred pup whose parents hunted just the way I wanted them to than pay 500 for a “finished” dog that I could just “get by with”. I STRONGLY enourage you to hunt with the actual dog if getting a started dog, or hunt with the parents if getting a pup. It will cost a little more up front, because you will have to do some traveling, but it will save you lots of frustration later on. I also recommend that before you start looking at dogs, hunt with several different hog hunters and see what style of hunting you prefer, then get dogs with that style of hunting. My style of hunting is different than longshot’s, which is different than 12 guage’s, which is different than hogwild’s, which is different than pops. Local conditions dictate some of those differences, but most of it is personal preferences, choose a style that fits your preference. I believe that the program above will give you the running catch dogs you want to end up with, while still having the brains and athleticism to live a full lifespan.

One other breed you might want to take a look at is jadgterriers. Their small size and agression might be just the ticket in real thick willows. I have no experience with them, but that is just because I have never found one that I could afford at a time when I had room to keep one. But I think that they have a lot to offer, and someday I will give them a try.

Good luck.

Bill A. Brockman

That all sounds awesome Bill! Im gonna get to lookin into some Catahoula breeders around here and see what I come up with, the fellow breeding Plotts in the next provinve over is away for a few days so im waiting to talk to him too, he breeds dogs for hunting bears so Im not sure if his strain is what im looking for.

As for getting to go hunt with some other hog doggers theres where the slight problem comes in, I dont know of anyone within a 1000 miles that does this up here so I would have to come to the states. Mind you that sounds like fun! I would have to find someone who might be willing to let me tag along I guess. Maybe I could trade someone to come up here and hunt whitetails or bears? Anyone interested could send me a message, hope thats all ok to do on this board im still really new here.

Thanks a million Bill and everyone else! Anymore advice or tips im all ears!

I didnt post on this one because I felt Broncobilly had already done a great job at laying things out.

I do think in Texas prices may be a little lower but there are a LOT more hog dogs supply&demand.

Great info here!!
Longshot

LOL at James,

Sounds like a pretty poor excuse to me, everyone on here knows that you have forgotten more about hog hunting then I will ever know.


Houndcrzy,

I use the same dogs I hunt hogs with to catch bear, lion, and occasionally a bobcat, so with the cross mentioned above, you would not need to feel handicapped if you decided to take your hogdogs and go after a bear or lion.

Bill

Wow guys thansk alot to all of you for the advice and offers to come hunt! Bill you sound a little to modest to me for all the info and advice you seem to have! Im excited to pursue this and get ta huntin with someone down there! I was LUCKY enugh to accompany my best friend on a lion hunt on Wednesday! AllI have to say is WOW IM ADDICTED to hunting with these dogs! We killed #180 pound cat and the dogs were amazing! I just returned from Las Vegas this morning and Im gonna be gettin backto the few PM'sI got right now.
Thanks boys this has all been great information!