PERMITS OR QUOTA in MT????????

[BIGBLUES]

Thought I would try to get some opinions and feedback on the quota system versus the permit system here in Montucky. What do you guys think????

[Yaak attack]

I think the new idea of permits the first two months and then a free for all quota will be the best way to meet harvest objectives in some HDs.

[BIGBLUES]

It will be better than what we got now, but I worry about fwp having too large of quota and the lion population taking too big of dive. The permit system is sure a joke to me.

[catdogs]

They both have their positives and negatives. I don't think the quota system would be so bad if they updated it more regularly...hell, you kill a cat on a Friday afternoon, it wont show up til Monday. If its the last cat, the season wouldn't close til Tuesday. Lots of cats get killed over those 4 days, especially over a weekend with good snow! I think incidentals should go against the quota too. The new "hybrid season" will be interesting I suppose. Kinda takes away the purpose of the permit and having all season to hunt a nice tom... What would you think about half permit half quota? Say an HD has a quota of 10, 5 permits and 5 on general quota? Best of both worlds, trophy hunt, or a hurry up and kill one opportunity. Or, permits one year, quota the next and keep alternating...?

[BIGBLUES]

I say try the hybrid way and see how that works out. There is plenty of lions right now.

[Yaak attack]

I can tell you that we have never suffered low lion numbers due to over harvest. In this part of region one we had a fine biologist that got us all together for an annual meeting. He gave us the facts and we gave him our recomendations.We had a lot of pull. Yeah, we had some butchers and game hogs, but we also had a couple of oldtimers that remember what it was like to drive a week to find a track. These guys kept our meetings balaced and convinced us that we needed to keep our quota low. If you can call 25 as in HD 100 low. In the three hunting districs we discussed, there were some unbelievable over kill in the early and mid 90's. We never let things get out of hand and our lion numbers never got so low that they could not recover quickly. So the question is: which of you guys are willing to develope a relationship with you biologist and go against the grain at those meetings for the sake of better hound hunting in your future. Hunting, not killing. You do not have to be the loudest, but being respected seemed to work for the older guys here.

[Yaak attack]

I can tell you that we have never suffered low lion numbers due to over harvest. In this part of region one we had a fine biologist that got us all together for an annual meeting. He gave us the facts and we gave him our recomendations.We had a lot of pull. Yeah, we had some butchers and game hogs, but we also had a couple of oldtimers that remember what it was like to drive a week to find a track. These guys kept our meetings balaced and convinced us that we needed to keep our quota low. If you can call 25 as in HD 100 low. In the three hunting districs we discussed, there were some unbelievable over kill in the early and mid 90's. We never let things get out of hand and our lion numbers never got so low that they could not recover quickly. So the question is: which of you guys are willing to develope a relationship with you biologist and go against the grain at those meetings for the sake of better hound hunting in your future. Hunting, not killing. You do not have to be the loudest, but being respected seemed to work for the older guys here.

[kehrer10]

wouldn't mind some permit areas on the east side of the state for some trophy units. also wouldn't mind some of the snow and lion numbers you guys over west have!

[Rico]

I like the permit system as for training dogs. But I figured that it would not last to long because of the unfilled tags. If they are going to go to the hybrid season what is the point in trying to draw a permit? That is like saying that you can put in for a sheep tag but if you don't get one you can not hunt them. Or you can wait till Nov. and hunt all the sheep you want.

The 50/50 may work but you would want to work closely with the biologist to make sure there is a solid feel for the pop. of cats.

Quota would be just fine if we could get the status line updated ALL of the time!!!

[Rockydog]

the problem with quota is each outfitter will hire 5 or 6 guys to drive roads all night and claim every track. makes it kinda suck for the average guy.

[furnfir]

well guys my belief is that a split season is an joke. I know what alot of guys will do simply hunt region 3,4,5,6,7 till quota fills then on feb 15th or whatever date it opens run over there and close their quota. I also think less people would apply for permits as a result. I personally think permits for lions is a bad deal anyway. I think maybe mt should make non residents draw a permit similar to Idaho. just my two cents and opinion.

[Yaak attack]

When we were in the quota system, our biologist learned that good snow and a 24 closure window meant severe overkill. It really doesn't bother me one bit to only take 25% of harvest objectives. I didn't mind the race either. At least you could pick who you wanted to hunt. I think from a management stand point, opening it up Feb. 1st to fill the unfilled tags makes the most sense. I think that 24 hour warning is not good, though. Make them call before sun up and close it with no notice if it appears a slaghter is eminent. Good snow and weekends don't go well when you have just a couple of cats left on the quota. I remember going nine cats over in 103 one year because of that 24 hour killing spree. We had guys cry foul when Jerry shut it down a few cats early, but we always had plenty of tracks, so I think that worked well for us.
Having 60 days to hunt with the other tag holders is a good thing. My wife and I have had three tags and did not harvest a lion. I passed on 17 different toms. I know a guy that has drawn four times in six years, he has killed four toms. Whatever works for you guess. I really don't care what they do, we still have some of the best cat hunting anywhere. Big toms, not so much, but want tracks, this is a good place with a long season.

[cat hntr]

Did not like the old quota system but would be ok with some kind of combo that would give the outfitters some tags and some permits for the rest of us.As long as the lions dont get over harvested is all I really care about.

[dhostetler]

I do most of my hunting in 100 and I would prefer to go back to the quota system. All the big toms we used to catch during the quota years are gone. I haven't caught a 150+ tom in 3 years. Last year I drew my first tag and decided my minimum is 150 lb. I treed what I estimated to be a 145 pounder twice in a months time, I never filled my tag and I am now starting to think that 145 pounder is the biggest tom in the unit. I have a tag again this year and believe I should probably be happy with a 130 pound tom however it is hard for me to shoot a small tom.

[Ringo]

Most you guys have probably been around here and doing this alot longer then I have. In the years of the quota I remember alot of small cats getting killed, I always thought if you killed anything over 120 lbs you were doing alright back then. With the permit season I have been catching bigger cats but the odds of getting a tag really suck. The cats around here seem to be thriving but this year its been tuff finding a big tom. I think with the permits the number of cats being harvested are under the FWP quota. I like the idea of 50/50. I thought they did the 50/50 for a year or two in this 100 region does anyone remember why they got away from that system.