BigGameHoundsmen.com

Mr. Dewey writes:

Tyler can you watch a dog on track or listen to a dog and tell what he is running, good game or off game without seeing the track? Dewey


Mr. Dewey I bet that you can tell by the sound of your Hounds if they are not doing the right thing! Dad can, Hootie Shaw can, Glen Rybard Can…most Houndsmen should be able to tell if the Hounds are doing something wrong from the sound of their Barking.

This might be taking a Back Track, running a Covered Track, or running Off Game. The Music should and will be off Key, too many flat notes. The ability to perceive the difference in the sound comes from the hours upon hours that Houndsmen spend with their Hounds! CJC

Mr. Dewey, in each of your Posts I am able to gleam a Pearl of wisdom…I have a file that I copy and paste them to….I read them to Dad and then add his comments (they usually sound something like “That’s what I think” to “ain’t that what I do”) You have given me several from this thread, but here is the best, at least for me:

If your home work is done there is little use for the collar in the field but always have one on them.Never ask a young dog something you can not enforce. Dewey

Hope the rain keeps up so that you keep these good topics up and going!

C. John Clay

C John Clay: It looks like we have a week or so of good weather. I will load and head to Northern California to area that is open for training for a while, time to get the young ones out to see what they have in them. There is nothing that I say or do in training my dogs that I have no learned from someone. Sometimes it is from several places and I just put it together. The only way that it has happen has been because I open and know I don't know it all. When I come up to a wall or get stuck with a dog, when things change I realize it was me that was stuck and not the dog. The dogs want to do right it just my job to communicate what I want to them. If you come up to dog that does not want to be a willing partner than that is a fault of breeding. Thanks always for your in put. Dewey

Dewey, I agree with you and C. John. When you KNOW your dogs and have good ears you can tell right away it the dog is after the right game, going the right direction, etc.

If it is a multi-purpose hound you will many times know what game it is.

However, time does have it's effect on ears (and other things) so it is not as easy as it used to be for me.

briarpatch

I have a good question for you guy's. Lets say a guy has a young hound that has good natural striking ability. It strikes with the more experienced dogs & is noticeably winding & working to find a track from the box, this dog is also considered broke. But once in a 10 hour hunt it strikes off game. At what point does a guy correct this dog. and from what point. should the correction be done instantly on the box? should the dog be given the chance to check the track then corrected form the ground? I guess my question is how do you stop it without hampering or taking away from its already good striking ability? I would also like to add a little to the above topic, I would think that a hunter that has put in enough time with their dogs & has seen enough game to know what their dogs are on based on the sound of the race.(you know who you are). also probably know what their starting before a dog ever opens. Some dogs perk up or dance around, pace back & forth, their tales may lift and /or get a spring in their step. I call this a tell. their working a cat. the same is true when over off game, only the tell should be the opposite, ears low tails down, just a day @ the office look. If I'm on to something would one of you veterans elaborate please. thankyou john,

I don't correct as instantly as many guys do. here is my reasoning. first my young dogs have to go a few days between tracks and even longer between races and trees. second if a young dog is showing interest but not really running a track or opening I leave him alone. this is also why I run bobcats. I didn't have the right kind of dog to really run bobcats here for a long time so my hounds spent some long dry miles between game. this is probably the hardest training scenario I can think of. I'd rather have a area with good game numbers flooded with trash to work a pup in. that gives them more opportunity to do right.
It doesn't take long to figure out what your hounds sound like working and what they sound like trashing. often there is a noticeable difference between species in your hounds voice.
most hounds can't help but give their deepest bawl on a musky old lion track it just gets pulled out of them. and deer or elk tear those yipps out real sharp. not all sound the same but the change is similar.

Broke. must be able to handle. to me this means if I want that dog to come he does. if we're hunting they stay where I want around the horse or in front etc. they load and unload. they will turn at a distance when commanded. can and will come home if lost or back to camp/truck. then I have varying degrees of game broke. very few run with out a E-collar and those have earned a once a year mistake even though they usually don't make it. if I have a long break in hunting the first few days everyone gets a collar. I admit I don't correct on the same level for all off game. some things you just don't run no matter what! deer,javelina,skunks and domestic livestock get a ZZzziiapp quick.
but real broke is a hound that runs what I want and only starts cats on it's own... those are the ones you send into the rocks first.

John wrote:

“I have a good question for you guy's. Lets say a guy has a young hound that has good natural striking ability. It strikes with the more experienced dogs & is noticeably winding & working to find a track from the box, this dog is also considered broke. But once in a 10 hour hunt it strikes off game. At what point does a guy correct this dog. and from what point. should the correction be done instantly on the box? should the dog be given the chance to check the track then corrected form the ground? I guess my question is how do you stop it without hampering or taking away from its already good striking ability?”

Dad says that it depends on the Hound….that they are like children and each has to be handled as an individual. With the Smarter Hounds a Hounddog psychiatrist might seem to be needed.

What are the circumstances of this bad deed…is there bad scenting conditions… is this the Hounds first transgression… are you sure it is off Game etc?

With one Hound a scolding and tone sent will make this Hound rethink wanting to bark when this scent tickles his nose. With another, especially if it is a Hard
Strike and the Hound is very excited about this smell, we will release the Hound, watch what he does (Working the Track as Warner5 calls it) and if he proceeds with its indiscretion, its neck will become very sore!

Sometimes the Hound when placed upon the ground will run over and get a good smell of the varmint, and drop to the ground expecting the world to fall in on it....this Hound just got the smell wrong...when it looks back at the truck a sharp "Leave it alone" is all that is needed.

As to hampering or taking away the Hounds Drive to strike, properly done discipline should not hinder him….it may make the Hound think a little longer before opening, but when allowed to run the right Game after striking a time or two all is forgiven by both parties!

Each Hound and situation is different….becoming wise enough to recognize this has been the hardest lesson for Dad to teach me!

As to Hounds “Working a Track”, very well put John. A Hound can tell you a lot by its Posture, Tail behavior, and Carriage!

All of the styles and things that I Post on here are things that work for Dad and where we Hunt. Please do not anyone think that there are not other ways to do things and have successfull results in throwing Ole Shorttails carcass upon the tailgate!

C. John Clay
Dads dogboy

C Jhon Clay: Well said I almost never shock a dog on the box. I let him down and depending on what he does is to what I do. What ever I say on here as you guys said has only to do with me it is how I do it. It works for me here and where I have hunted with the type of dog that I hunt. NOTHING is written in stone if it works for you fine if it does not work fine. I will listen to anyone and can learn. Sometimes it is what not to do. Dewey

dewy where in north state are you headed just curious how close to my country your headed jim

Mr. Dewey,

In your travels, have you found problems with your Hounds being "Deer Broke" on Muleys but not on Whitetails, or vice versa?

Dad has sure seen this when taking Hounds to western OK, TX, & NM.

Anyone else have this problem?
CJC

The first time I went to Colorado My dogs ran mule deer like pros. Yes it seems to be a difference in trashing with different areas. Dewey

Although not cat dogs my dogs were pretty much broke off of Mule Deer and when I started hunting up by my place and ran into Coues deer they became unbroke.

Amen dewey i like the way u think.im young but i no the truth when i hear it,i feel giulty tho i have my young pup with no old dog and i let him pritty much run wat he wnts except deer ,which i BREAK him of every chance i get. i geuss it gives me some sick satis faction that i no that my dog has what it takes.u no what i mean, i love to see him throw his head back and tear a hot track a new ass hole,even if it is a turky i saw walk down the trail.lol

Dads dogboy wrote:Mr. Dewey,

In your travels, have you found problems with your Hounds being "Deer Broke" on Muleys but not on Whitetails, or vice versa?

Dad has sure seen this when taking Hounds to western OK, TX, & NM.

Anyone else have this problem?
CJC

On the coast we have black tail deer but the east side of the cascades have muleys and whitetails.

I had a couple year old dog that never ran deer his whole life. He just never felt the need I guess. First time he smelled a mule deer he blew up and ran that thing with everything he had. I shocked him back to the truck and drove on. It wasn't a couple hours later he had another one going. He was running it with a vengeance, I think he was looking for retribution for what the first one did to him.

Same thing happened with a veteran 12 year old dog that had seen hundreds of bobcat. She hadn't ran a deer since she was 5 months old but she also hadn't spent much time on the East side of the Cascades. First time she smelled a whitetail deer she hit the ground running. I never understood this because she never showed an interest in off game most of her life, she was what most would consider a very well broke hound. I wouldn't expect them to run something just because they have never smelled it before.

Old topic but I just had the time to read through it.

so how do you decifer weather or not a dog strikes a yoty pissen post with fresh dogs

I found myself working to many dogs this winter, all was good until my younger dogs took to out striking my old dogs, at 1st we caught cats young dogs out striking the old dogs. So when I saw a mistery race deep down I knew it, but I was hesitant to correct because all had been well to that point. This process took a few weeks of working the dogs but, what I finally did was the dog that struck it 1st checked it. Now I may have corrected on a good track or two but, what this did was made the younger dogs think before they struck and kept the older dogs honest( they knew what was up). Broke dogs are broke unless they see you allowing it a couple times, then all bets are off.(jmo) If all the dogs are allowed to come off the box when a dog opens.. Thats a disaster waiting to happen. If you dont have an older broke dog, try roading your dogs through the mistery strike area's. watch and see which dogs are competing with the yote's( pissing on the same spots they would strike but hopefully not run and lightly correct them for it). One summer I spent the whole time chasing my dogs all over 2 counties. It sucked but I learned alot. And I could probably use a little more learning at times. I hate crash coarses though. Good luck have fun. John.