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Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:44 pm
by DC DOGGIN
10 4 Fellas thanks for the replies.
Piglet is your female out of sampson as well ? if so who's the dam of male and female. That goes back to what twist has previously stated as to the dogs producing top hounds and at what percentages turn out above average. Those nice dogs may produce nice pups, but how do those reproduce. In your case not so well and i am sorry to hear that.
Agian thanks for the replies. DC
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:22 pm
by festus
DC,
we are having good results with the Nance blood. We have developed a breeding program around a line bred Nance female ( Millie ) using both Topper, and Sampson. We are into our fourth generation now and have had very good results. The hounds we have are not perfect and have some issues we are working thru, but over all we are making forward progress toward our end goal with each generation.
One of the best reproduceing hounds I have seen, for the traits we are looking and breeding for, was a son of Sampson out of Toppers littermate sister Ryley named Slim. The Ace II dog is a proven reproducer, he is out of the second Sampson / Millie cross. We have two littermates a male named Luke and female named Penny out of a Slim / Millie cross that are both proven reproducers. We bred Penny to a dog we called Jasper (a full brother of the Ace II dog ) and every pup in that litter is a nice hound. We bred a female out of the Jasper/Penny litter named Ruby to a dog we call Buzz who is also a full brother to Jasper, and the Ace II dog ( Sampson/Millie ) . The Ruby/Buzz cross was impressing some pretty hard hunting houndsmen at the age of nine weeks old. So I would say the Topper and Sampson / Nance blood will reproduce.
In my opinion you have to have an idea of what type of dog (traits) you want to end of with. Then develope a breeding plan based around knowledge, proven breeding principles, honesty to yourself, integrity to cull as needed, and the determination to see things thru to the end. The Nance blood as well as some other bloodlines will reproduce if done right. Hope this helps answer some questions.
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:26 pm
by DC DOGGIN
Festus thank you for your reply.
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 3:37 pm
by Todd Davis
DC DOGGIN
This the product of the SAMPSON/TOPPER/ SLIM/ MILLIE/ DOTT, ALL IN ONE PACKAGE. I would like to give Josh (festus) a BIG THANKS on helping me on this cross.
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 7:05 pm
by DC DOGGIN
Sly cat, do you remember a while back i was complimenting on your dogs, and how good lookin they were, now I know why. Thak you. DC
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 7:37 pm
by festus
Slycat,
Your welcome, those sure are some nice looking pup's for sure. Those pups daddy, Ol Pilgrim, is a littermate brother to the Ruby female I refered to above, both of them being out of the Jasper/Penny cross.
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:15 pm
by Redneck
twist wrote:Just to let everyone know Topper is looking very good and doing well and for him crossing with Lipper or Pac Man blood, here is my thought if she has any hunt in her what so ever your chances of Topper Again crossing with her should be some outstanding results. As to Mike post what he is getting at is everyone is always standing around wading in the water when they need to just commit and jump in. Yes he said these two hounds are getting some age and while everyone that is hum hawin around wondering what route they are going to take and checking every other route that might save them a couple cents, to maybe get that hound of a life time they are missing the big ride. These two great hounds have nothing to prove in the BIGGAME WORLD they have already done that from catching game to being top producers. Like high desert hounds has said they have produced many great hounds and they are and will be here to breed to now and in the future (but the only question would be are they a proven reproducer yet?) I truely believe that if you have a female that has hunt in her, that breeding her to Topper is a wise choice. Happy 4th weekend to all. later, Andy
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:29 am
by Todd Davis
DC DOGGIN,
I do recall, Thanks,
All i did was pirate someone elses line .
Thanks Todd
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:42 am
by twist
Until a person tries a pup out of old Topper and one of my female. I wouldnt go knocking them to hard I have been into the old Nance strain longer than most could believe and yes they have PROVEN theirselves for close to the last 30 yrs at my place. For the ones that have hounds out of Topper and my females I believe it would take a pretty penny to touch one from one of their owners. Just ask slycat on here his female, (Topper Again daugher) which is the mother to the pups above was on 30+ lions and a few bobcats last year as a young dog (8 months old) when she was turned on her first cat last year and never looked back as she never missed one out of all these cats she ran 100% pretty impresive for that age. Is she for sale Todd? Then slycat took my littermate to his female (Maggie Again) for the later part of season and she did the exact same trailed and treed like she had been doing it for years. So to each their own but to say they would never try a Topper pup and to have never have given them a chance is truely a mistake. Oh by the way Todd with them tails docked you are probably right they will even trail faster now with less weight. lol great looking pups. Andy
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 2:40 am
by Mr.pacojack
I had a dog off of ole Topper Again and I can tell you the one I had was a very, very nice Lion , Bear and Bobcat dog. Made a lead dog. You can send me one of those dogs anyday, but please don't send me one out of sampson.
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 4:35 am
by festus
Redneck,
I can assure you the reason Jeff sold Topper had nothing to do with Toppers reproducing ability. Jeff will tell you himself Topper is a reproducer.
Redneck wrote:twist wrote:Just to let everyone know Topper is looking very good and doing well and for him crossing with Lipper or Pac Man blood, here is my thought if she has any hunt in her what so ever your chances of Topper Again crossing with her should be some outstanding results. As to Mike post what he is getting at is everyone is always standing around wading in the water when they need to just commit and jump in. Yes he said these two hounds are getting some age and while everyone that is hum hawin around wondering what route they are going to take and checking every other route that might save them a couple cents, to maybe get that hound of a life time they are missing the big ride. These two great hounds have nothing to prove in the BIGGAME WORLD they have already done that from catching game to being top producers. Like high desert hounds has said they have produced many great hounds and they are and will be here to breed to now and in the future (but the only question would be are they a proven reproducer yet?) I truely believe that if you have a female that has hunt in her, that breeding her to Topper is a wise choice. Happy 4th weekend to all. later, Andy
knowing jeff there has to have been a reason that he got rid of that dog he dont just dont get rid of any old dog ,yes my pups are nance bred too but i wouldnt bred to topper im going to i know about jeffs old lines and some what where they come from great sales pitch though give ya props on that , if i was going to bred id go straight to jeff agine or if these pups turn out use the same line of stud i used to get these little guys salt from the original ace line hank and cindy line
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:03 pm
by DC DOGGIN
REDNECK how long have you known and hunted with jeff?
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:37 pm
by Fat Couger
I wanna snuggle with those puppies!!!!! The are so cute!!!!!!
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:56 am
by Todd Davis
REDNECK
Not to start any thing but i think Jeff SOLD salt and pepper before they Where eight years old, I could be wrong ?
Re: Topper Again/ Centerfire Sampson/ Samson
Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:57 am
by Redneck
i know that jeff sold salt and pepper before they were 8 i used salt as a stud on my female i wasnt trying to start a pissin match here they were 2 years old when he sold them ones in montana and the other is in colorado now he also regretted selling them too but what can ya do