Plott houndsmen, I want you!

[reed]

I haven't a clue of who this Catch fella is, but would process of elimination work? You could dna the other two males all pups and which ever ones didn't match the two living males would be the dead males offspring? What if none of the pups were out of the dead male? Would it matter then if the dog was dead or not?

[Ike]

Good point Reed, but if ol' catch has plott dogs that will do what he says who gives a crap what sir they came from? I have papered and grade dogs at my house, and the only thing that elevates one of those hounds over the other is how well they perform, cause the color and papers just don't do it for me...........

ike

[Catch]

Your unwillingness to put forth a truthful answer to what happened with those pups is good enough. I have given you plenty of chances to "set the record straight" about what happened to those pups. But what are others and myself to think and conclude with your continual "Dancing" around the issue besides your trying to hide something. Your answers in themselves have shown to all exactly what your all about and what MAY have happened. That's not a accusation, it's apparent and the obvious. I have tried to avoid this issue from the beginning so most by now have figured out that I don't need nor want a answer from you to any of this kinda stuff you carry. It's your baggage, you carry it. Has I also have said from the beginning of this, at this point in time this issue has no importance to the Breed other than showing what kind of stuff you do. De DeMoss possibly switching papers on Timber was not a issue, nor was even Drum being papered, was not a issue until their offspring became productive to the Breed. Same with this. Has I have said all along, time will tell all.

For those that may not know. UKC allows multi sired litters because sometimes accidental breeding's occur. But because of what it is intended for, accidental breeding's, it is all over the rules allowing it that ALL parents and offspring will have a swab taken and a DNA-P and a DNA-VIP analise done on them ALL. It is done this way to protect the Breeds from "those others in the woodpile" that may not of been known about. This was absolutely not possible after Thunder's loss. It is also well documented in other writings on this that Marshal never got the swab taken before Thunder's death by Marshal himself. This only left him three options after Thunder's death. These are not accusations, they are facts that MAY of happened. One of them definitely did has there's no other options available, and all of you reading this can make up your own minds to which one truly occurred. I could careless about what he did.

(1) He sold a highly publicized litter of registered pups, that several months later was found out to be unregistrable and put the shaft to those that bought them.
(2) He reimbursed those that bought those pups in some manor for not having papers for them. Which means his actions contributed nothing to the Breed, contrary to what he's now bragging about.
(3) He "found" papers for them. Grade dogs contribute nothing to a Breed, only papered dogs do. I have asked the very simple question of if this litter of pups contributed to the Breed twice and have yet to get a answer.

Has I have also said from the beginning, whatever possessed you to bring this subject up about yourself in the first place. I know you and your intention to others well. By your bringing this up and your continually "baiting" me to disclose what I know about anything you may or may not have done in the past, you yourself have given me full authorization to bring this and any other information I may know or suspect you of doing forward to all. From the beginning I have shown no intentions at all and have been very reluctant to bringing any of this or anything else out, has I will continue to do. The way I see it, it solves absolutely nothing except introducing you and your possible actions to others. Your the one that wanted your "Pandora's Box" opened to what you may have done to others and the Breed. Has far has I'm concerned your "Pandora's Box" of actions to others can remain closed because this issue was just lifting the latch on it. Of course, that only my opinion and all can make up their own minds about these types of things.

You caught me Dennis!
You don't have a clue to what happened, but you sure as hell want to know. I told you in a past post. The results was never told because of something I found. You can babble on all you want. Go get the facts about that cross then give them. Read what you write before you start trying to convince people about these pups. Look at this Dennis, you wrote: These are not accusations, they are facts that MAY of happened. One of them definitely did has there's no other options available, and all of you reading this can make up your own minds to which one truly occurred. I could careless about what he did.

LOL
Now did these facts happen or MAY of happened? You could careless about what happened. Get real dude, you just wrote a essay on what MAY have happened. The tears are rounding down my face from laughter.

Here are the facts, you don't have no idea what you are talking about, and you never will. I will decide if the facts ever come out, not you and your make believe team of investigators. You will never figure out what happened so put this to bed. Get some damn sleep!

[Catch]

I haven't a clue of who this Catch fella is, but would process of elimination work? You could dna the other two males all pups and which ever ones didn't match the two living males would be the dead males offspring? What if none of the pups were out of the dead male? Would it matter then if the dog was dead or not?

Ding Ding Ding, we may have a winner!

[Catch]

Good point Reed, but if ol' catch has plott dogs that will do what he says who gives a crap what sir they came from? I have papered and grade dogs at my house, and the only thing that elevates one of those hounds over the other is how well they perform, cause the color and papers just don't do it for me...........

ike

Good point Ike. The fact is, I do hunt and breed only papered dogs. I'm not saying they are any better than grade dogs, this is just the way I want it.

How is the hunting in Utah?

[Ike]

The bear hunting is going well, hunting about everyday off I can and only problem is keeping pads under some of the dog's feet long enough to get through bear season! That damn shale and sandstone is sure tough on a good bear dog.........

Nothing wrong with breeding papered hounds if that is what floats a person's boat!

ike

[Smiley]

Dennis you say you have not wanted to bring this up that Catch is the one that has , well that is a lie you continually elude and bring this up in about any situation you can.
Anyone that want to know the truth let me know I know where the offspring are and what they are doing . Dennis thinks he knows but he does not have a clue .

[Dennis Fisher]

I haven't a clue of who this Catch fella is, but would process of elimination work? You could dna the other two males all pups and which ever ones didn't match the two living males would be the dead males offspring? What if none of the pups were out of the dead male? Would it matter then if the dog was dead or not?

Ding Ding Ding, we may have a winner!

We have a winner with you for sure Marshal. There is no ding, ding, ding when it comes to registering multi sired litters. Nor is there a process of elimination. If the DNA sample given of a pup contains even the slightest variation of the genotypes of the parents given the litter is considered inconclusive and is not registered. There is no way to hide one out of three males has not showing up in one way, shape or form in a litter and get it registered. For those who wish to verify how to register a multi sired litters the first link will show you whats involved. The second will tell you all about how the DNA-P and DNA-VIP Profile Program works.

http://www.ukcdogs.com/WebSite.nsf/WebP ... NADSLitter

http://www.ukcdogs.com/WebSite.nsf/WebP ... DNAProfile

[release]

Dennis,


You finally put up, now shut the hell up. I've concluded from reading your various posts that you are one pompous wind bag that loves to hear himself talk, and read what you write. Do you really have a clue as to what you're talking about or do you make this crap up as you go?

[John Weston]

Mr Fisher you are a first class ASS. Do you have any of these dogs in your yard,if not why don't you just SHUT UP! Every forum that I have seen you on your a know it all DICK HEAD! Papers are for starting a fire and these are just dogs.

[larry]

Or maybe the dogs were never papered, why hasn't that option been deemed a possiblity???

[Catch]

Dennis, Dennis, Dennis. The next time you want to take a run at me, get some facts that are facts not "May" be facts.

Reed and Larry aren't even on the investigating team and have more facts then you. Reed, you can find the sire by process of elimination. Thunder may or may not of even been a father. If he was not one of the sires, problem solved. UKC was contacted on the this matter. They said, send a letter explaining what happened along with the DNA from all dogs involved. UKC told me, the process of elimination would be used to find the sire.

Larry, you are correct. The puppies where never registered. They were never registered because I used a private company to find the results and do a test on what I had stumbled upon. The puppies where never sold, they were given away. Since there was no money involved Dennis, I reimbursed no one. So Dennis, since the pups were never registered, I did nothing wrong. Get it, you were chasing a ghost. I didn't want this to come to what it did, but you open your ""Pandora's Box" live with it!!

Since there is no wrong doing Dennis, I will await for your apology on this matter. You called me a fraud on a "international" web site. Man up and say you are sorry!

[larry]

Oh wow! Looks like somebody has way to much free time worrying about what everybody else is doing. I'd love to take you up on that hunt offer Catch. I'd be interested in a pup if you think there will be any left over when the litters pop.

[Catch]

Larry, I have to get pups first. LOL

Next Friday I will be picking up the male that is being used. One of the three females started bleeding last Monday. It is going to be a race to the finish line. There will be females other then mine bred to this male. I will keep you posted.

[plottpappaw]

Not to be a smart elic but i've really gotten a few laughs out of this thread! I felt like i was back in high school again listening to girls argue over shoes! I'm glad its pretty much solved and would agree on the apology! I would also like to commend you on going through the pains of the dna profiling and being thorough enough with your breeding to check it all out!