BigGameHoundsmen.com

Was doing a little thinking today and I'm curious as to what other houndsmen think about this: Why is it that in hounds, especially big game hounds, you don't see guys with really set up kennel operations? Now, I don't think houndsmen don't have some slick setups but coming from the horse world you see barn after barn of multimillion dollar setups where there is NO MONEY BEING MADE. They just love horses and spend all kinds of $$ on them from truck to trailer, tack, real estate etc. People that are dyed in the wool "horse people'....How come many of us are only weekenders and not dyed in the wool "dog people"?

Also, I ran into a bird dog guy today at the gas station. They are all over the place here and I see them all the time. These guys are all rolling in super nice rigs, full body dog boxes on back...Like the kind you take the bed of the truck off for....$20k+ dog boxes (plus the cost of the truck on top of that). They always look sharp too...I mean they are "ready" to meet the public and promote a good name for bird dogs... I'm sure they all love their individual lines and breeds but they sure as heck seem to pull together as a group and put a good foot forward. Do you think this is because there is more $$ in it as a whole? More accessible to the public or "less work" for the average joe? Food for thought....

So, why don't we see more of this with hounds? I'm not looking for BS thoughts like "all houndsmen are rednecks!" cause we all know that's not the case....At least I think...LOL. In competition coon dogs you see guys with better kennel names and they sure enough promote a line or a certain dog a lot more than we do. Do you think it's because there is no real competition for big game hounds? I sometimes wonder if the competition hounds the game does the talking for them? We get so bowed up on here about who's dog can out hunt anothers that we all get thread after thread trashed and thrown in the cage....Do you think we all have a stigma that if a guy produces multiple litters then he is a "puppy mill"? Or do you think it is because of hunting laws, areas being limited and the idea that our sport is dieing? Other thoughts? I have my own but I'd be curious to hear your guys' thoughts. Hope this isn't too long and a million questions....

A different type of people with a different set of prioritys.

Good questions and some deep thought. Thanks for asking us to raise the bar.

These are some hard questions to answer. One thing for sure the public sees this too.
The publics perception, right or wrong, is what will defeat hound hunters in the end.

The terrian we hunt is not what the pretty trucks are made for. The game we hunt is tough and can not reproduced for us in game preserves.

I'm not sure if the political views on this forum speak for everyone but the political frustrations probly do. I mean the advertising, the promotions, taxes, kennel laws,and the hasels of making your hound sound better than others. Most want to tree bears or cats and let the hounds speak for themselves.

In the end we need to make sure what we do is perceived by the public as fair and fun. Show your support and join a club.

Good question. I have been thinking about it for a while. I live in the center of Horseville. There is stable after stable of big money set ups. The real estate in my area has gone through the roof, if you can put some horses on it. I just figure it has more to do with stature. People in the horse world appear to be competing for the nicest stable around. Last time I checked you didn't need a million dollar barn to house a horse. But there are a lot of them around here. Up the road from me is a Friesian Horse facility. Those horses just muddle around the field day after day. You never see the people go anywhere even though they have a $75,000 trailer in their yard. The owners spend all their time at work or scooping poop in the stables and fields. I know there are people that are relentless about working their horses. Around here there are working horses and decorative horses. The decorative horses are usually running around a pretty nice place. Lots of horses, barns, and trailers in the drive way, but you never see any trailers on the highway. With the amount of horses around here there should be a horse trailer traffic jam every Saturday morning.

I am not saying that horse people are phony, just the ones that live around me. Most houndsmen are never home to enjoy a place like that, they are actually taking their dogs out to do what they were bred to do. I have often wondered where all that money comes from. I make a pretty good living, probably above average. In order to have that type of place I would have so many payments that I wouldn't be able to hunt.

As a shoer I have frequently been to those "horse peoples" barns. Most of them are crazies who think more of their horse than they do their families. As for me I think I have a nice set up. It aint as pretty but its a barn with cement floors, electricity, running water, store bought kennels that are 10x10 and a one acre turn out pen. My tracking system is about $2000. My shocking system another $600. $150 CB Radio in my truck. I paid 3500 for my lead dog. My truck is a 2006 Dodge. All of the gas that I use up taking my dogs hunting. A $100 a month feed bill, not to mention vet bills, spay/neuturing, rabies shots, and licensing. I have seen plenty of houndsmen with fancy dog boxes. Ran into one that paid over $3500 to have his custom built out of aluminum. They guys who are serious hunters take care of their dogs and have decent equipment. There are some good people who havnt been blessed with an income enough to afford all those fancy toys. I dont judge someone by their set up. Only their actions.

LarryBeggs wrote:A different type of people with a different set of prioritys.

exactly.

i dont run dogs to impress people, i run dogs because that is who i am and what i do. a fancy set up would be nice though, there just aint no way i could afford it. so for now plastic barrells will have to do.

To me it seems there are "classes" of people.

I fit into the "redneck" hound hunter class.

My truck is beat up (but runs good and is mechanically sound), the dog box is ugly, the kennel is dirt, 2x4's, t - posts, and field wire/horse fencing. I spend about 1/3 of my take home income paying for my truck, insurance, gas, and the hounds.

I live in a 5th wheel trailer, and am buying an older single wide to get set up next spring. My yard is a mess, and my days off are spent lion hunting, getting ready for lion hunting, fixing something as a result of lion hunting, or getting groceries and washing clothes so I can actually go lion hunting, and then make it back to work and still have a clean uniform.

I don't have any registered dogs, I don't breed for the purpose of selling dogs, and I don't care how ugly they are, provided they can hunt. Champion, GrNiCH, etc, mean absolutely nothing to me in my lion hounds. I don't have any sponsors, no chrome dog box, and a 40 year old handyman jack.

There are people out there that spend a lot more total money than I do on their hounds and hunting, have nicer rigs, fancier dog boxes, and better kennel set-ups, but that alone doesn't mean they catch more game, or less game, than the person with the less fancy equipment.

Then there are the people who only care about what they look like, and how everyone percieves them, no matter how they actually are, and whether or not their dogs can catch or not. It seems that there are some who only have a couple hounds, hunt a couple weekends a year with good snow, and leave the hounds in the kennel or on the chain for the rest of the year. They are in it for a short while before the wife gets pissed and makes him sell his useless mutts. Around here, and around certain people, just having a hound makes you a hero because you "kill lions." Some people get off with that, and it helps boost their ego.

I am not sure if that made sense or not, but oh well.

Later,

Marcial

Anyone else?

My Buddy Houndawg said it best years ago. I believe it was a quote from someone else.

He said "If you pull up to a guys place and the lawn is mowed, yard is tidy, truck is nice, horses and dogs are fat and the wife is happy, he ain't got shit for dogs. You show up and the yard is a wreck, lawn ain't mowed, truck is beat to hell, dogs and horses are hard as a rock and his wife hates his ass... That guy has some DOGS!"

Rockcreek wrote:My Buddy Houndawg said it best years ago. I believe it was a quote from someone else.

He said "If you pull up to a guys place and the lawn is mowed, yard is tidy, truck is nice, horses and dogs are fat and the wife is happy, he ain't got shit for dogs. You show up and the yard is a wreck, lawn ain't mowed, truck is beat to hell, dogs and horses are hard as a rock and his wife hates his ass... That guy has some DOGS!"

i love it, that right there says it all

I will put my two cents in. I think a lot has to do with pride. What means the most. It would be nice to have a fancy rig, but for most thats not practical. Where I hunt its rough and not many roads. I have an 83 gmc and stock trailer. My dogs ride in front of my horses. I would rather show up and unload a nice using horse and a pack of hounds that can trail in terrible dry conditions and mind better than most border collies than show up in a $75,000.00 rig with sorry horses and dogs.

I also think there is a lot less work in the bird dogs. But they seem to attract the people with more money. Go figure. Guess making that dry ground lion dog from start to finish is just to tuff. Not many will venture there. Also I think most houndsmen have one or several real jobs. They are outdoor people so their jobs are not going to pay like your high paying office jobs do.

One thing about it. Those horse and dog people with fancy places and rigs will probably be paying on that stuff forever and maybe even late on payments. The rest of us regular people have our bills paid. A pride thing again. We don't have to worry about who to impress tomorrow, we just wonder where El Gato made his kill last night.
Happy Trails,
Missy Holmes

Amen RockCreek.

We are the public, i think houndsmen are going to get deffeated by houndsmen
I wish they wold take a saticstic on how much we spend at the DFG compsred to other hunters.I buy all the tags bobcat,pig,bear,dear,and an upland game stamp incase I see a gobbler.I was in a line of people getting nothing but dear tags.

Most likely somebody else trained his birddog and he paid good money for it. That's the dog man. I'd guess the dog man is more humble. Since people eat chicken it's more acceptable to kill birds than teddy bears.

Haha. That's some funny stuff Rockcreek....and, you may well be right.

Let me ask you this though..... If you pull up to a super nice horse barn, lawn is mowed, truck is clean....do they have crap horses? Having been a farrier for years I've found the opposite true. You roll into a nice cutting horse barn, million dollar everything and odds are they have some badass ponies stalled up.

Its interesting to hear everyones take on this. I find guys that have older rigs, beat up boxes tend to say that's what "real" houndsmen do. I gotta say, the birddog guys I mentioned are working dogs all day everydat. I also agree with what u guys said, there is more $ in birddogs and its easier to one 1 dog and have someone train it. Its interesting to me that nobody really fancys themselves as THE bigame hound trainer. I know I sure as heck wouldn't want to, or couldn't probably for that matter but I'm surprised nobody makes a serious business of training biggame hounds for the public.....at least that I know of.

Also, I don't think horse people always do what they do out of pride. Surely some do but some must just be able to afford their lifestyle and they enjoy it. I know many people with nice everything and they own it all. Free and clear....

Good thoughts

Brady Davis wrote:Its interesting to me that nobody really fancys themselves as THE bigame hound trainer. I know I sure as heck wouldn't want to, or couldn't probably for that matter but I'm surprised nobody makes a serious business of training biggame hounds for the public.....at least that I know of.

I do know of one guy that does this but I think location has a lot to do with this. He lives in a state that used to have a year round lion season. It has changed now to Sept.-May with a few loopholes in certain units. The ever increasing laws, rules and regulations in most states would make it tough to do.