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What are some things you guys do to benefit your pack like adding and deducting dogs and so on. Also where do you start when putting a pack together, start with a tree dog or locate dog, or good track dog, and so on.

Merlo,

Others probably will have a different feeling on this than we do, but here it goes anyway!

The MOST Important Bark in any Bobcat Race is that 1st Bark.....so to us a SOLID BROKE Strike dog is where we would Start a Pack!

For me its also a broke strike dog never had one to work with or start dogs with so have had a fun bumpy road but been getting it done. Seem's like alot of guys want a tree dog first. And just wanted there reasons why?

Dads dogboy wrote:Merlo,

Others probably will have a different feeling on this than we do, but here it goes anyway!

The MOST Important Bark in any Bobcat Race is that 1st Bark.....so to us a SOLID BROKE Strike dog is where we would Start a Pack!

No one could argue with that! However, most have not had that luxury. For myself, prefer a young hound from a linage where most have made track and tree dogs at a very young age. Have owned a couple young walkers that treed their own bobcats, ( not the hard running, duck, dodge type ) at a very young age. With little to no snow here, found it much easier to coon hunt those young hounds, running bobs when possible, never found coon hurt those dogs any. Breaking off coon, when the time arrived was in most cases not hard to do. Yes a young tree hound would be top priority when starting over. I have a 18 month old half trigg & treeing walker that shows tree naturally, also rides the box feet on the rail and strikes, roads nice also, not wild but busy hunter. I had nothing to do with her breeding, bred by Ted Wilson. Was told by a local hunter who hunted with her littermate, he saw that young male get out on a cat that was giving the pack a hard time and tree that cat ahead of the older hounds. Doubt, I will be able to hunt enough to do this female justice, but enjoy her. Fourty pounds and pretty as a picture, small boned, very good hair, tight feet. Al

Im a huge believer in getting a dog from good breeding, but if that aint possible I believe some dogs can be made with area's of high Cat populataion's now i might be wrong but I hear people talk about there dog only see's this many cats and there dogs do progress cause of great breeding but I also see guys who just grab a dog from John down the road and they come out to excel beings there ran just on bobcats and lots of them..... I like to start with a dog that shows alot of potential on tracking rather then tree'ing then add a better tree dog later. Right now I have all track dogs and I lack more then I would like at the tree. But they do just hang around where the cat goes up. So its not to huge of a deal for me to go in and help out. My oldest dog is 2 so I have along ways to go still. I'll get rid of a dog if it cant handle and put good enough pressure on a cat by its self.

merlo_105 wrote:Im a huge believer in getting a dog from good breeding, but if that aint possible I believe some dogs can be made with area's of high Cat populataion's now i might be wrong but I hear people talk about there dog only see's this many cats and there dogs do progress cause of great breeding but I also see guys who just grab a dog from John down the road and they come out to excel beings there ran just on bobcats and lots of them..... I like to start with a dog that shows alot of potential on tracking rather then tree'ing then add a better tree dog later. Right now I have all track dogs and I lack more then I would like at the tree. But they do just hang around where the cat goes up. So its not to huge of a deal for me to go in and help out. My oldest dog is 2 so I have along ways to go still. I'll get rid of a dog if it cant handle and put good enough pressure on a cat by its self.

With such a young pack, how can you be sure you are always running cat? Are you hunting an area with a good road system? In my opinion dogs can improve when ran on lots of cat, however a dogs track style is a bred in trait. Glad you have a healthy cat population. Al

Number one to me is genetics. And number two with out a doubt is a start dog, whether she can rig or just road that doesn't matter. But she has to be able to start and move that track, imo.

Mic

Al, I do alot of hunting with a older gentlemen who has broke dogs so when Im out with him Im 100% running cat. I have a 2 yr old that has been trusting she starts over half our tracks for us and is pretty bent. Also have another two yr old thats pretty clean, I do have a good road system so I get to see the cat quite a bit. But I will not say Im not ever running crap but I feel good about a high percentage of my tracks.

Thanks Merlo, that explains a lot I have wondered about. Al

Merlo that statement said a mouthful. The ability to believe your dogs are running a cat when there is no visible track was the toughest thing for me trying to get started. So much trash, so few bobcats, and no broke dogs. No faith in your semi broke dogs, shocking collars and an Idiot running the controller, make for some long nights. Trust me I know. A honest strike dog changes everything, you must have one to have faith. Treeing and good locating dogs are great, most but not all want, or need one, I do. When having this very conversation with Mr Finney he said son, you got your cart ahead of your horse, what good is your tree dog, if you can't put a cat in a tree. None. I have had bees that didn't sting that bad, but once again, he was right.

Good to see you posting Ted. Right on about hunting dogs one don/t trust, that's why those old reliable strike hounds are some hard to get hunters to part with. Pepper being a perfect example. My feelings on a locating tree hound, is here it has been easier to find track hounds, than good locating tree hounds. Without one makes for a lot of tracks that end an hours hike away, leaving one to wonder what happened. I have to say most of the running dog crosses I have seen here took a much longer time to make a tree hound than the good tree dog stock that tracked & treed. Will say once those part runnin stock became tree hounds they were some good ones.
Little off subject, but when hunters talk about finding better hounds and starting over, I always think do they realize how hard that is to do. Especially when I know the ones giving the advise has some very important hounds in their packs that are the same breeding I and others have hunted much longer than them. The only two ways I was able to get those dogs I trusted to start cat, was stay with hounds, hunt often as possible & be very selective who I hunted with, or once in a great while find a good hunter who was getting out that had invested lots of time & money and produced those type hounds. It is a very good feeling to have a pack of five to seven hounds one can turn loose ahead of a rig in trash infected woods and relax knowing there is a very slim chance of running anything other than the few cats. Leave with this thought, having a track, without a tree hound, one is not much without the other. Al

This is the stuff I like to read!! Great post!

Well I hope some day I'll have that good strike dog but until I win the lotto I think I'll just have to tuff it out and play with what I got. I would love to have a decent strike dog the things I could do and the young ones I could train... haha...

Great topic! Agree with what has been said for sure. Would like to add that a dedicated and consistent handler is high on my list. Examples in hunting situations being things like looking at what the dogs are showing interest in and physically running/walking with them from start to finish. With or without snow there should be some type of sign to confirm an honest race. My oldest dog is only 3 follwed by 2.5. If either of those dogs show tail or open i am 99% sure it is bobcat or lion. The time and effort i spent on them taught me a lot more than i would have gotten out of a purchased broke dog. Would have been less headaches though!!!!! Now i have added a leopard and a running dog cross to see if they will advance things further than the 2 "older" tree dogs can. Meaning brains and track speed on a sneaking cat, negotiating blowdowns, etc. We shall see. Currious to see if the running dog will keep up with the bluetick!!!!!!!!!!! Couldn't resist....sorry Oregon boys

All posts are great!

I would only add--that strike dog must also be a "tattle-tail"! When a loss has been made, and the young hounds decide to duck left--is nice for him/her to show up in front of the truck or on the tailgate---saying "not-good" the best they can! And you have to trust them then also. My young hounds will get a dose of electric when that happens. No hesitation! Happened night before last---roaded hounds about 1.75 hours with not strike. Then coming down road meeting hounds was a coyote, and he face barked--just screamed at us. Young hounds had to run that thing, they thought anyway? I let them go for about 200 yards--then lit three of them up! They sure were glad to get in the dog box.

Drove to another area---& here is the postive thing on this---let two hounds out went 100 yards or less and struck a hot bobcat track---dumped all hounds on this track and had about a 30 minute race, catching on ground! Could not have been more perfect, unless the bobcat had treed for them.

My screw up on this was that due to deer season, holidays, weather and not getting to hunt my hounds like I normally would, I had 10 Hounds with me! I think that if that was cut in half, the race would have lasted longer and bobcat may have treed? All of the hounds were from 16 months to 2.5 years old but two of my older hounds. They have had a number of bobcat races, plus some lion action, so they are pretty tuned in as to catching.

Just my two cents,

Clyde