BigGameHoundsmen.com

If some one is bored and wants to translate this into English for me, I would be greatly indebted:

Have we identified some sex-linked genes in our hounds? I have heard the Clays talk about some. Anyone know the ones Cary has mentioned? Is that what this following piece is talking about?

[the success of Motherline breeding comes from utilizing very important sex-linked genes present only in the additional DNA of the X chromosomes of great producing (Stamm) females ... since a male dog has 76 paired chromosomes plus an X and a Y chromosome the only place a male can inherit these important sex-linked genes is through his mother ... therefore; when this son becomes a father only his resulting daughters (never his sons) get this valuable X chromosome back again (along with another X chromosome from their own mother) ... in turn, when these resulting grand-daughters become mothers the art of breeding lies in selecting only the male offspring that inherited this valuable X chromosome (as these great-grandsons will be able to pass the important sex-linked genes on to their get) ... in so doing we bring the influence of the Stamm female (through this valuable X chromosome) to the topside of the pedigree and dramatically improve our chance of producing great pups true to type when we breed to quality females from the same Stamm line ... thus the importance of having an unbroken Motherline on both sides of the pedigree]

It' the same with Gamefowl in most cases David. The males will be like their mom and the female like their Dad.

That's an interesting comment Brad .I remember Steve Matthes writing the same thing.JTG ,if you're on here i bet you could give David some info on this topic.

Ok so I don't know if this is the same thing. But Mr Finney Clay believed you would see the nose and brains of the dame passed to the pups, and the mouth and style of the sire passed to the pups. At least in his line of dogs. Correct me Carey if that is wrong.

So is this peice saying that IF DONE CORRECTLY, this females nose and brains will be seen in her great grandson and that he will be able to pass those traits on to his pups even though it is a female passed trait?

The 2nd post I lost was, re-invent the wheel. I said "why not", you can't do any worst than some.
If you hit a "nick" with a cross. It can be set as a strain in 8 yrs or less and you will be catching all the time you are doing it!! 3 times in - 1 time back, that's the way the Kings did it'

Brad are you losing your posts due to being automatically logged out? I might have explained it better under " question for Dewey" but if you will do this you can hopefully protect your work:

BEFORE YOU HIT SUBMIT:


Highlight your entire post by holding down the left of the mouse and dragging across it. Then right click your mouse. Choose "copy". Then hit submit. If you have been logged out, them log back in. Go back to the "reply" blank page. Left click on it
Then right click. Choose "paste".

Smile real big and say the same thing you would say to a cat that you just treed. You know, that one that has beat you repeatedly and laughed at you. Then, hit "submit". And I mean HIT submit as you say your final words to your inferior foe.

If we are referring to a recent article in one of the coon dog magazines, it is hard to understand and it’s obvious that the author does not understand it either.

There are 78 chromosomes in a dog, or more accurately 39 pairs, not 77 chromosomes as mentioned. In the cell of the male chromosomes, one pair is not identically shaped, while in the female, the pair of chromosomes is matching. This pair is called the sex chromosomes and the other 38 pairs autosomes.

In nature there is nothing more powerful than the male being bred to his daughters, and then, their daughters, and so on. In doing so, the gene pool gets tightened and the heredity becomes fixed, passing on most of traits from one generation to the next. From the same pair, if you were to breed the mother to sons for several generations, in time, you would have a completely different and noticeable strain and those genes also become fixed.

In regards to a litter of pup that have been inbred for many generations, each pup is different because each pup, does not get exactly identical genes. A dog does not pass on a gene that produces certain traits, it inherits a complete DNA structure and sex- linkage and sex- limited is a part of that structure.
Yes, we have identified sex link genes in hounds. One example, Hemophilia B (failure for the blood to clot normally). “The condition is unlikely to be very common in the view of early death of effective males. When it does occur, breeders are well advised to eradicate it and they can best do this by carrying on bloodlines of carrier females through their normal sons” (1978 ) Dodds. This method, or tool of removal, can also be used for many other things.

Males determine the sex of the offspring, XY sex chromosome and the female XX, any genes that are carried on the Y chromosome will be passed from father to son and none to the daughters. Genes carried on the X chromosome cannot be passed from father to son, just to daughters. The female will pass an X chromosome to each son or daughter and not necessarily the same one.

JTG

JTG-- Question here--
Just what genetic traits have been identified to be sex linked beside the Hemophilia B-?

Sex-Limited or Sex Linked---> some, breed specific.
Sex of litter.
Size of litter.
Cryptorchidism.
Head size.
Gout.
Hip Dysplasia.
Bone length as structure.
Body size and weight.

I like the definitions on page 256 of, The new art of breeding better dogs by Kyle Onstott and revised by Philip Onstott.
“Sex-Limited trait. A trait (usually a secondary sex trait) which manifests itself in one sex and is either absent or greatly reduced in the other. Sex-Limited genes are in the autosomes, not in the sex chromosomes”.
“Sex-Linked trait. A trait for which the determiner is on the sex chromosomes; specifically, a trait carried by a gene or genes in the non-homologous portion of the X chromosome. Traits carried in the homologous portions of the X and Y chromosomes are said to be incompletely sex-linked”.

In Days of Old, it was quite common to hear "OFF WITH HIS HEAD in the name of the KING"!
I'll bet it didn't take long to find what he wanted and reproduce them.
How about a brown cow with a white face or a Dog that could catch a red fox. I think you know what I'm TRYING to say????

Yes, it is weird and maybe even sad how much we have to re-learn what was already known. Those European breeders had some stuff figured out. And like you said their lives depended on it in more ways than one. The quote I gave was from something written before 1910 in Germany. Then translated into English much later. I can't imagine trying to translate something like that.

Thanks much to all who are helping me to try and think more clearly about it.

"Selection" is the answer to Breeding (IMO) and of course luck!
Many breeders will make an out cross, in-which has missing traits needed to make their line complete. You may try many times to find the one that fits you, but you will know it when you do.

Seems like people always try to make things way more complicated than they really are. If you want to learn how to breed dogs all you need to do is look around.

Most everything in nature produces way more offspring than needed. Only a small percentage survive long enough to reproduce themselves. These are the ones born with the traits most needed to survive. After a few thousand years pretty much every deer and rabbit looks and acts like the rest.

I'm pretty sure deer don't know or care if they are practicing inbreeding or outcrossing or mother line breeding.

The only time a change happens is when selective pressure is applied. Think antibiotics.

If you would forget everything you ever heard or read about breeding dogs and tried to breed dogs like nature breeds animals (and plants and insects and bacteria and...) you would be way ahead of the game.

David, in the not too old days many fox hound packs (European breeders) sent upwards of 200 puppies out to walk each year. The pack size always stayed the same.

A few years back, I was able to go to Australia. While there I stayed a week with the Pres. of The Victoria Houndsmen Assoc., a short drive outside of Melbourne. I also went to their Kennels, and talked with the Breeder and Caretaker. These dogs were Fell Hounds from England. And a couple were "red headed and shoulders" lighter colored Blueticks!! Did you know that, Bird dog was added years ago and still some do today, if they were lacking "NOSE". Anyway that is what I was told over there....I seen were some Ozzy's have posted, maybe there's a Fox hunter reading?