Let’s talk.

Talk about Big Game Hunting with Dogs
bowieknife50
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby bowieknife50 » Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:22 am

That is a bad deal right there. This is the first bear we've walked since the first day of training. They just have to show up close to season. We're fortunate enough to have enough trails to be able to get to them pretty quick.

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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Fri Aug 27, 2021 2:06 pm

I have a question for you guys. In hog hunting, I want my dogs baying the head end but when the hog doesn’t want to set up and bay, I want them trying to tear its back end out from under it. Not pinching because that will usually just push them. But really reach up there and grab a ham or their pride and joy. They will turn and fight if the dogs do this and if all the dogs are doing it, they will back up to something so that the dogs can’t get to them from behind and all they have to defend is the head end. Many times I have walked up on a good hog literally sitting because he got away from cover and the only way to protect the south bound end was to sit. They can still fight but obviously can’t run off and aren’t nearly as bog a threat. Do y’all look for this type of thing on bad bears or what is y’all’s preference?


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rickyfarrell10
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby rickyfarrell10 » Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:14 pm

A bear is the same really. He will walk until he gets tired of getting his ass chewed on, then he will back up to tree, rock or what ever he can find and fight. I want a dog that is gritty and make him climb but don’t want a stupid gritty one. If he is walking a long then they better be chewing on him. First bear we treed this year climbed within 500 yards. Before we could get to the tree he came out and wouldn’t tree again. He ended up killing two of our best dogs


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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:43 pm

That makes sense. It’s the same with hog dogs. Too gritty and your out of commission until they heal or you have dead dogs. The right kind of gritty is a really fine line, at least for what I like.


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rickyfarrell10
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby rickyfarrell10 » Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:55 pm

My gyp plott in the last 8 months has had 9 holes in her and ripped rib muscles. I was hoping after the first one she would learn to stack back, go in grab fur and put pressure on them. She will be 2 in November. I am kinda in a rock and hard place with her. When she got holes last December, wife and kids wanted her inside to heal well she has never made it back out to the kennels. She has been in the house since. Wife and kids are attached to her and worry, that one day I’m gonna come home and she wont be busting through the door with me. At 6 months old she was running and treeing. Everything just came natural to her.


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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Fri Aug 27, 2021 5:39 pm

Is that all you run is plotts? How is she bred?


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rickyfarrell10
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby rickyfarrell10 » Fri Aug 27, 2021 6:08 pm

She’s white hollow and Pocahontas cross. She opens when she finds the track and usually doesn’t bark again till she is looking at it. I have 2 male plotts they are Pocahontas. They do good just not as quick as my gyp and they are to mouthy on track. Have a full weems bred gyp that’s just turned a year that’s doing really good. Last weekend on that mean bear. She was in there for the whole time. Also have an older cur dog and a gyp redtick that’s does good


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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:43 pm

I see. I like quiet and fast too. Did you notice the Pocahontas dogs maturing any slower than the other plotts?


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bowieknife50
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby bowieknife50 » Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:45 pm

We want are dogs to know the difference between front and back ends. See back end try to get a bite, but as soon as they turn they better be flying backwards or they're going to get hit. In my limited experience the dogs that are too gritty never back down with time. We have a couple in our pack that get hurt on every single bear that stays down. I am actually really good with my dog that doesn't get hurt a lot. If he is within 5 ft of the bear barking hard that's good enough for me. The other guys can have the alligators that go to the vet all the time. I think a bear is either going to tree or stay down. Some tree in the first mile with one dog like mine who is right there barking but is not going to wade in by himself. The one the other day was only 150lbs and had dogs all over him and was not going to go up a tree no matter what. We've put 300 pounders up a tree with just a couple dogs. I think it's more the personality of the bear than anything. P.S. I have a full pocahontas female pup that seems like she's taking a lot longer to mature than my other dogs. Doesn't really mature because she's young enough I want planning on putting her on a bear this year anyway. Oh and we need a lot of barking as soon as the track is jumped so we can cut dogs in to the cold trailers.

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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Sat Aug 28, 2021 9:12 pm

Bowie, sounds like the grit is a fine line for y’all as well. There are dogs like that hog hunting too. I gave a young man a dog a few months ago. He puts on a show when he’s baying, but when he gets on the bigger hogs he seems to nearly always get cut and not just a minor cut. His problem isn’t that he’s overly catchy, but that he doesn’t have a back up gear. When a bad hog rushes him he stands his ground. This is when he takes his punishment. Giving even a little ground could be the difference in getting cut or not cut. He’s either going to get tougher and start catching those hogs or he’s not going to be long for this world. Hogs have evolved over the years, at least here around home. There is a hog dog under every shade tree it seems like. So they are dogged regularly, every farmer and rancher tries to shoot, trap, and even run over every one of them that they can. This makes the survivors wild. The ones with the fight before flight mentality get caught first also. So that leaves the runners to breed other runners. For this reason I breed for tracking speed and quiet on track. Not that dogs that bark on track can’t do it but it doesn’t get the same result. I had a female that barked on track. I cast one morning and she struck a track in the open pasture. She immediately opened and continued to bark. She hit the brush about 200 yards later and was probably 50 or 75 yards in when I told my nephew to look. The hogs had gotten up and were leaving out of that set of woods about 350-400 yards to the south. We caught one shoat over a mile away. We went back to that same exact spot a month later and caught 4 or 5 with dogs that are silent trailers and fast tracking.


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bowieknife50
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby bowieknife50 » Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:59 pm

I'm quite sure we could catch more bears with silent dogs. We have some runners that when they get ahead they will open ground on the dogs at every crossing. If the dogs got up on then without giving them that had start i know they would catch more. I think a big part of it is the group I hunt in. We all like to hear the music and everyone wants to be able to cut their dog into the race. I've talked about getting more quiet dogs and everybody looks at me like I have 3 heads.

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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:47 pm

Lol I hear ya. I understand it’s about the race to a lot of folks more than it’s about catching the bear. I’m obviously not a bear hunter though so I can’t say lol.


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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby Cajun » Fri Sep 03, 2021 12:57 am

The situation I am in is that I dont bearhunt as much as I used to. I dont need the grit I had in my Plotts for bearhunting. It is too much for hoghunting and I always have dogs that are busted up. I have hogdogs that will run and tree bear but I wouldnt call the beardogs. There is a difference.
While I mostly hog hunt I like the open dogs. If he can smell it and move it, I want him or her opening. Dont like a dog that stands on his head. I am way past the numbers game and enjoy listening to the dogs work. As long as they give me a honest effort I like it. There are places where we have easy hogs and places where we have the tough ones. Nothing I like better then running one in the ground. Might take a few relays but that is what I like.As far as silent dogs catching more hogs, I have had both. I really dont think it matters if they open or not but the amount of dogs you have on the ground. I have put out open dogs one at a time and they have bayed hogs in there bed. I have places wher you could put 3 or 4 silent dogs out and as soon as they are one the hog it will break every time. the hogs they have now a days just cannot take the pressure. jmo and may not be the opinion of the viewing audience.
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lawdawgharris
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby lawdawgharris » Fri Sep 03, 2021 3:53 am

I really don’t think there is a right or wrong way or a wrong or right style of dog as long as it’s ethical and the person feeding and hunting them is satisfied. I’m not nearly about the numbers anymore myself. I do this because the way a good dog works amazes me. The tricks and techniques that the good ones learn and use is at times mind blowing. The speed and fluidity that they use to get through the brush just makes me wonder how they put their feet in the perfect spot while bending and at times almost contorting without missing a beat. I’ve seen them when I didn’t think a snake would’ve been able to be any slicker moving though the same terrain. Digging out a hog that has been bedded and not moved for the longest and in thick cover. Another is just the opposite when they hit that hot track and move it as hard as they can possibly run, and that’s pretty dang fast, and bay within a super short time frame like someone posted the hogs location on a tree for them. I love to watch one throw their head up go to hogs they’ve winded. I’ve seen it where the hogs were a couple hundred yards all the way up to a little over .9 on my garmin. The line they ran to them was as true and steady as you could free hand draw it and it didn’t take long. Leaving with the wind instead of into it because they are smelling or know something I don’t lol, and putting up hogs in short order. Watching a dog(s) that know a hog is there but can’t get it located and they just start making circle after circle and tighten the circle down until they have it is super smart to me. Watching them cheat a track at times. They seem to know when they can do it when they can’t. That’s another one of those things that make me ask how do they know when they can or can’t. Another thing is drive to hunt no matter the circumstances. I love the stay put dogs. The ones that if they find it, they are gonna be there until you are. I get to my dogs ASAP. Sometimes I let them bay for a while but I will be within a 100-200 yards letting them. Usually this happens when I have younger dogs in the mix. If it’s a young dog on their own I’ll get there quick as I can to build that confidence. I have seen them stay for a long time. I let a friend have an older gyp to school his pack of young dogs. She ruptured her Achilles and on a hunt and never quit the race. First hunt back after they amputated her leg, she was cast solo at 9:30 pm and at 9:52 she bayed. They missed the hog and she bayed him again 7-800 yards later. Their light died and they couldn’t see to get into her in what they said was a ridiculous thicket (probably true in that part of the world). They decided to go home and come back in the morning. At daylight when they got there she was still in the same spot still baying. For me that’s want to and desire. That confidence that my peeps are gonna come so I’m gonna stay here and sing to you until they do, is amazing. These are just a few examples of the things I love watching and experiencing. Even with the catch dogs, it’s a different job but still amazing. I don’t lead my catch dog. He stays with me off leash until I say go, whether it 30 yards away or 30 feet. That discipline is pretty cool. I’m aggressive by nature, I don’t know that I could do it if I were in their shoes lol. To have that you can’t beat me mentality and believe it even when the odds definitely aren’t in their favor is inspirational to me. Most people think they just run in and get ahold but it is so much more than that with the really good ones. Their accuracy and athleticism combined with toughness and smarts as well as bravery are the kinds of things that heroes are said to possess. These animals have it to a degree that if it were a person, many would consider them almost a god like person such as Achilles. So I get it Cajun, I understand why you like listening to the music when you hunt. If I got to choose the type of mouth my dogs had, it would be a big ole hound bawl while they bayed. To me there’s nothing any prettier to listen to unless it’s Dolly but I get to hear her all the time because she’ll always love me. She told me that in one of her songs but nobody realized it was me she was talking to lol.


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Beebout-it
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Re: Let’s talk.

Postby Beebout-it » Thu Sep 09, 2021 12:11 pm

I'm absolutely certain that my 12 year old is a more responsible human than myself lol. We have had a trip planned to go bear hunting in New Mexico since last December. He recently found out he was starting left guard for his middle school football team. We are supposed to leave out for 10 days on September 24th. After his first game of the season 2 days ago he gets in the truck and says Dad we need to talk about the new mexico trip... I'm like whats up buddy? He says well my teams really counting on me so I don't think I can let them down by missing that much practice and a game. He goes are you mad that I don't want to go!? Although my wife had already hinted he was feeling this way i was very proud of his decision. Then last night he's coming in from practice and I told him I had a coon to go show the 15 week old pups and he says I have way to much homework to go mess with the dogs tonight! He's making me look bad to the wife!! :lol:

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