BigGameHoundsmen.com

I give up I think fishing many be fun.

Mic i dont know where you seen those but they have been collaring bears down south by snaring for a study. this is the third year of that. maybe different area and totally different deal than what you saw but the ones i know about are being used to gps collar and release.

Zz

mic, mel. greetings....
why snares?... why not hounds?... oregon did this...used the snares to catch study bears and fitted them with radio collars...what they didn't understand was trying to recapture the same bear in the steel it was caught in the first time....may sucker a few but caught by the leg and fighting for their lives hardly makes a bear want to repeat the same dumb misteak over....

huge problem for the bear when they are fitted at 125 pounds and grow to be 250 pounds. you guys have reasonable folks at least trying to use houndsmen unlike oregon...might get to do some hunting when you can explain the lack of science/ thinking behind there approach and you guys can get the job done and in a more humane fashion. i'm with you mic...a bear caught longer than 6-8 hours has serious problems

i also think garmin is busted mr white.........a gps that can last longer than 24 hours...

Maybe, the collaring thing is true. I hope so. My problem with this is I came to the realization along time ago that we can never get our hunting back the way it was. But if we could get the opertunity to help in these studies and allow us back in the woods would be a win on the part of houndsmen in the state. We have made some progress with our lions. And I beleive it's a fair process with the drawings. But I wished the DFW would allow a pilot program for our bears. Use us and by all means abuse us in the fashion that heck we will pay them to help with the study.

So we are working to better our relationship with WDFW. We spend time trying our damnedest to be a responsible outlet for the game dept to use for studies, public safety, or what ever else. I honestly believe it is a step in the right direction. We have gained some ground, making steps to both keep us in the woods and to get more cougar hunts. We will see what the future will bring. One thing that concerns me are people posting that the game dept is using snares for population control, even though we don't necessarily know why they are using snares. When we hear of the game dept doing something we need to group up and start communicating with them in a positive manner. We need to remember that we are trying to grow credibility, and with that comes some responsibility to get facts. Not jump to conclusions. It is my understanding that the initiative to ban hunting with hounds specifically states that hounds cannot be used to pursue bear on public land. There is one big reason for the use of snares. It would take legislative action to make it permittable. I definitely do not know everything about this, but we need to not publicly slam anyone if we want to continue to gain credibility. I really appreciate the efforts made by all who have spoke up and worked to gain ground. I am sorry if any one feels singled out by my post, I am just relaying my opinion.

I am sure there are GPS systems that last a whole lot longer than 24 hours. I think you could probably outfit 10 houndsmen with Garmins for the price of one of the game dept collars. Not yet the equipment to track one.

George, maybe everyone is taking my paoint out of text. The sign said it was for population control. My point was if they are going to do a study, we need to convince them that hounds are more humane than a body gripping trap that could easily result in the death of the animal. About 7 years ago the SETA program used hounds to recapture bears on a study in the Capitol Forest, which is public lands. Plus everyone who hunts lion in the 6 counties are hunting public lands. So I know that under certain hunts we can use hounds. I'm not saying let's attack them I'm saying if they are going to do a study let us get involed instead of a snare.

Mike those gps collars are the same as the ones for the cougars and they last for years. i am all about more hound hunting but in reality if 8 out of the 10 bears bay and fight instead of tree like they seem to do up here , it is not safe for the dogs or bear to try to get a dart in a rank bear.what do you do when you have a bad bear running dogs down and all you have is a dart gun or imagine trying to thread a dart in a bayed bear in that 15 year old trees with thinnings waist deep, and you cant get your dogs off it or kill it because its a study not dep. hunt, then what do you do?.they have tried that before up in snoqualamie with a qualified houndsman and it just doesnt work.with the snares they caught a ton of bears with no problems. if they were like the cats and just went to tree everytime it would be great, but they dont. not trying to be negative but just stating the facts of past experiences.

Mel White wrote:Mike those gps collars are the same as the ones for the cougars and they last for years. i am all about more hound hunting but in reality if 8 out of the 10 bears bay and fight instead of tree like they seem to do up here , it is not safe for the dogs or bear to try to get a dart in a rank bear.what do you do when you have a bad bear running dogs down and all you have is a dart gun or imagine trying to thread a dart in a bayed bear in that 15 year old trees with thinnings waist deep, and you cant get your dogs off it or kill it because its a study not dep. hunt, then what do you do?.they have tried that before up in snoqualamie with a qualified houndsman and it just doesnt work.with the snares they caught a ton of bears with no problems. if they were like the cats and just went to tree everytime it would be great, but they dont. not trying to be negative but just stating the facts of past experiences.

Mel, I think you may need different dogs.

not my dogs. the guys that hunt this area right now have the best dogs i have ever seen and they still dont want to tree. even if it was one out of ten, what do you do when that happens? have you ever hunted here? how would you know? thats a totally different post in its self. i am just stating facts. there is some hard working guys on here trying to help wa hound hunters. (mic, your one of them) and we appeciate that. but some of the issues that they have put on here and that have been brought up at meetings are hear say and so far fetched it is making us look worse than better. i have heard that wa hired a guy from ID to come kill hundreds of cougars for the game dept, the game depts karelian bear dogs are going to take over and on and on. none of these are true just like game dept using snares for pop. control . if you dont think they read this i bet your wrong. they probally just laugh at all this outrageous stuff and wont ever take us serious. you need to have staight facts to work with and not rumors or speculation

Mic,

I am sorry if my post upset you, that was not at all my intent. I appreciate your efforts and the goals you are trying to achieve. I have absolutely no desire to hunt bear with hounds, none the less, I will do everything I can to support the effort of guys trying to obtain more hunting. I believe we are all in this together, and we need to try to stay civil with each other. I read through my post and I can see why you didn't like it.

It is my understanding that the use of hounds for bear depredation on public land is prohibited. This would also include population control. Whether hounds were used in a bear study I don't know, but I can see Mels point about bears that do not want to tree. My issue is not about the specific details in this discussion. It is more about the way I feel we should be communicating with the Game Dept. It is only my opinion that ultimatly doesn't amount to much. If they have have signs up that say they are using snares for "population control," lets get some photos and gather some facts and present it to the powers that be. I imagine it isn't cheap to buy snares, pay for man power to set them and monitor them, just so the bear can be dispatched. I would assume the Game Dept would rather we payed to get a permit and hunt them for free. I look at this whole thing like we are walking on egg shells. I don't think we should roll over exposing our bellies, but I feel we loose credibility if things are posted that aren't true. I would think the Game Dept reads this forum.

I understand that we are using hounds on public land for cougars, but we are working off a public safety platform. I don't think the Game Dept has the authority to just turn us loose on public land to hunt bear with hounds. I think this is going to be a long uphill battle. Our hunting was stole from us with a BS campaign that didn't represent facts but emotion. I think we need to be level headed and use facts to get our hunting back. Why are they studying bears? What role will it play in helping us reach our goals? My understanding is that Capitol Forest is getting flat out hammered with bear damage. If they are using snares for population control, lets see what we can do to help get the WAC changed. It doesn't make sense to me to pay Game Dept employees our money to do a service we are willing to do for free.

Sorry if my post upset you, but fishing is no where near as fun. Don't quit yet!

I'm with Mel on this one.He's stating facts,anybody who has seriosly pursued,hunted,harvested bears inwestern Washington[some areas more than others]knows there are some educated and bears that come from long lines of walking fighting bear.AS I've said before[not looking for an arguement]I've seen a top pack of bay dogs-who see 80-120 bear a year.Show up in some of these areas and look pretty wooped in2-4weeks of hard running,and never show any weaking anywhere else any other time of the year on bear.
And they're not my pack,so I've no reason for excuses[not that I let mine off the hook anyways-LOL].
Tim 541-912-6464

I'm done, I simply wanted something posted about snares and there use. I don't believe in snares period. Everyone says that hounds are cruel. And I have heard about what happens to bears in snares. My dad has pics of bears they killed in the 60s and 70s missing feet because of snares. If they used the culvert traps no problem. But they are not. I guess no one shares my hatered for the traps. And yes the game dept is reading this or Someone tipped them off about it. Trust me! Game dept do what you want, I don't agree with how it is handled but I guess it's your game animal and not mine. Do what you want. I'm sorry for the post................

the way i see it the game department is going do what they want when they want. ifn they where smart they would open back up a hound season for bear again and charge a $100 buck hound fee this way they dont spend money on damage control or studys and they make money. think of all the hound hunters who would get back into and new ones that would start. i think they would make a little cash and not spend so much.

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