question dry groundin bobers

[houndnem]

Most of the time I will drive right over ten fresh bobcat tracks to chase an old lion track, but the last month before it ends I start running a bunch. I usually catch three or four throughout the winter(pretty good snow), but For every ten I chase I maybe catch one. let me rephrase that I can catch them but they jump and jump until it's night time and I'm twenty miles from my truck. then when all the snow is gone and I'm out in the desert chasin lions, I catch one every time I turn around. Why are they so easy to catch in the spring and fall but so jumpy in the snow? our bobcat season is nov - feb so to catch one any other time is in a sense trashing.

[George Streepy]

Houndnem,

Are the bobcats jumping from trees, or are they getting bayed up and then running again? The reason I ask is because I almost never get bobcats to jump trees. In fact it is some times hard to get them to jump if I wanted them to. I have seen them move around in the tree and sometimes jump to the next one but not jump out and run again. I know guys can bay them but my dogs won't, the just get a hold of them and end it. I was just curious what type of problem you were having, maybe bobbers down your way act a little different. I catch most all of mine between December and middle of February. But that is also when I hunt the hardest. Good Luck.

George

[houndnem]

Most of my problems are in deep snow and lots of rocks. our bobcats usually live in the rock piles and cliffs. If I cut a track in the trees and sage, The cat is usually in the rocks sleeping by the time I turn out. once bayed in the rocks they hang the dogs up and run like hell. we'll catch em again and again, but if they don't tree I usually can't get to them. the bizzar part for me is that I catch them in the rocks on the dirt and they stay put. I guess the part that bothers me is that I catch more bobbers on accident on dirt then I do on purpose on snow. granted I never really focus on hunting the bobs, just fun to run on days I can't find a long tail track.

[George Streepy]

That is interesting. I wonder if the snow slows the dogs down enough they can't quite get a hold of it. I mainly hunt bobcat and have never bayed one. It is either in a tree or done before I can get in there. I suppose they could just sit up on a rock and rest and then jump and run like hell. I have seen them get jumped out of a tree and take off so fast that there isn't a dog that could match that type of speed. The trees are thick here and after they thin there are alot of Christmas type trees on the ground. It is hard to even get through sometimes. I have watched bobcat skip across the top of a run of thinnings like a bullet. The dogs could only go through at about a tenth the speed of the cat. But it is like the tortoise and the hare, eventually they catch up and get it caught. All I can think of is the speed the dogs can move on dry ground compared to the snow. A close call on dry ground and the cat may think twice about trying to outrun the dogs again. They are shifty little buggers, but that is what makes them fun.

[BEAR HUNTER]

I just watched the video "Catmen 1 & 2" by Ted Reynolds and Nelson Cole hunting bobcat, lion, and lynx in heavy snow. I was amazed at home many bobcats bayed up at the base of trees. The hounds would be baying and the cat would be laying down in the snow hissing at them but would not climb. If the dogs had any kiind of grit those cats would be dead before the hunter could get there.

[kordog]

clients dont want to pay to walk in to a bobcat tore to pieces could be the reason . nelson is in it for the money .

[George Streepy]

Maybe some guys know alot more than me, but I don't know that a person can train dogs to not get a hold of a bayed bobcat. I think once they build up the nerve to do it they will from then on. Every dog is different and I have some that are real aggressive and some that would stand back and pepper step around barking. Most of the better dogs I have owned went right in and got to work.

When I hear people talking about cats jumping from trees and running all day around here the first thing I want to say is "Are you sure you were running a cat?" From what I have seen they pretty much commit to a tree, hole, culvert or whatever. I have had them caught in a culvert many times and had the cat come out of the pipe and go right back in. A challenge for some one, crawl in a culvert and try to kick one out, you will regret your decision. The cat is usually there to stay.

I am sure it is different down south, and I would wager Houndnem knows the difference between a bobcat track and a coyote track. But up here the guys usually talking about this aren't running a cat. Bobcats will pull all sorts of "tricks," they will learn to use blown over trees, thinnings, rocks, brush and anything else that they can to get away.

Houndnem, are you catching more toms on dry ground? Maybe running more females in the snow. That would make sense to me because toms leave more scent and are easier to catch. If on dry ground a female would leave alot less scent so your dogs would probably be more apt to run those stinky toms. In my experience the 16 to 20 lbs females are the hardest to catch. They are faster and leave less scent. On dry ground your dogs may decide to run that stinky tom and in the snow you may be putting them on a female track? Just a thought.

[kordog]

i think he uses bay dogs so the client can do the shooting is all im saying it has nothing to do with training . how many clients would pay 1800 to walk in to a dead cat that is shredded. alot of the cats here would rather die on the ground than climb a tree .

[houndnem]

Thanks for the info guys. keep it coming were not done yet. george, it sounds like you have a ton of experiance with these and I value the info. the last bobber I caught on dirt was about a month ago and a small female. most often on snow I feel like they are big toms just because I cut several tracks every time I'm out and I only turn on the great big ones. and yes I know the differance between a yote track and a bobber. I don't know how guys get the two confused, but I have buddies that should know better that have dumped the box on a yote track thinkin it was a bobber or lion. When the snow is real powdery you might mistake a fox track for one,but even then if you walk it out it wont sit and do figure 8s like a bobber will and the stride is wrong. The one thing I have found down here snow huntin them is, if you cut a track crossing the road about 20 times look for the track headed for the rock pile. I have dumped on that track and been lookin at bober in the tree in minutes. my dogs will shred them if they bay up and the dogs can get to them, but they will do the same on a lion. heres some pics. double click to enlarge them.

This is the one last month. he was lucky we were there to save him





this was a five minute chase on dirt. turned out on a lion.




This one was caught and got away. didn't have enough rope and harnesses for the dogs.




Small female bumped on dry ground while casting for lions



one big tom that wasn't lucky




large female