The fizzler.. Some dogs fire right up and then fizzle out...

[bigboarstopper]

Talking with my huntin partner the other day about some of the dogs from years back while estimating the up and commers. The topic of dogs that start out amazing us beating out the veterans only to become 2nd or 3rd string players as time progresses. Whats your take on the dogs that seem to potentially be your next pack leaders und up fizzling out.

I had a young dog years back I started at about 10 months old. She did amazing things out striking and just doing better then the vets. This lasted a good 6 months then over time she simply began to fizzle out. about a year or 2 later she went from 1st string to 2nd to 3rd. Cant say that anything in particular happened to her. No bad wounds to make her shy. No trashbreaking issues. Nothing out of the ordinary. Hasent happened to me since. This has happened once or twice to just about everyone I know.

Whats your experience?

[wanchese]

had it happen with one our dogs over the last couple of years. he was great right out the gate but now he tends to be more of a pack dog than one of our front runners. i dont have any idea why but it happened. i also have had a dog that wasn't hardly worth the food he eats for about 3 years now he is our number 2 dog.

[poser]

Bigboarstopper, i havent had a dog start really good and then fizzle out, but i did sale a young dog @ 8 months old that was by far the best dog i have ever owned at that age that ended up not even wanting to bark at a house cat.....

They are just dogs.....they aren't perfect just like most of their owners. How many people in professional sports are suppose to be the next thing and don't make it. This stuff happens everyday with people i wouldn't worry about it just move on to the next one.

Hope that things are well, jason

[pegleg]

I have seen it happen but the highest percentage seem to be hunters who push real hard on pups to get ready for their first season and then lay them up completely when season closes and the second year the youthfulness of the dog gets them through but just barely. the third year they don't remember shit. I've seen it happen to all types of dogs bird dogs working dogs etc. dogs that are worked moderately and consistently seem to keep their edge longer. I start my dogs later then most and don't hunt them as often as the older hounds. I make it a point to leave them if they had a real hard day before. this may keep them from seeing as much game right off but their hunting life is extended compared to some hounds. sometimes the dog just gets lazy. others leave you scratching your head for a reason.

[BEAR HUNTER]

PegLeg I believe you are exactly right. I dont start my pups untill they are around a year old depending on the dog. I have ruined a lot of good pups by trying the old advice of start them as soon as possible. Its just like starting a young colt. I try to keep it fun for him and then end it on a good note. If I worked him to a frazzle everytime I rode him he would get sour real quick. I also found I need to keep things new for em cause they can get bored real quick. A young pup is exactly the same. I think that at a young age less is better.

[plottpappaw]

i must also agree. kinda like thw kid who's parents push them to follow their foot steps. kid just ends up rebeling. i also tend to wait until a pup starts maturin. i believe that the dogs in question may have the ability to be your number one dog but if pushed past their breaking point wll only do enough to get by once they have become burnt out.

[sourdough]

Over the years I have learned to be very skeptical of that pup that turned it on at a very early age as I have found that most all hit a wall very early and never progress any further the later starting pups have always done better for me and I feel the reason for that is they mature at a more even rate making them process what they learn better. What a pup does when it is very young always stands out because they are very young but, as time passes though they maybe doing the same things they haven’t progressed and they no longer stand out. I guess I can compare it to elementary school when a few of the kids matured early and were physically better athletically than most kid the same age but, once those same kids hit high school the whole dynamics have changed and those kids no longer stand out and are average at best.

sourdough

[festus]

Pegleg, I agree with you 100%. In my opinion most of those young super stars that blow up like that are ruined by improper handling, and or to much pressure to early.
Alot of guy's are so proud of there young super star and think if they really work him hard and force feed him ton's of game he will make a super hound quikly.

Think about it, would Michael Jordon be the dominant force he was if he would have been thrown into pro basket ball when he was 8 years old and expected to compet with pro athelets both physically and mentaly at that age and stage of his life?
Most likely he would have become very frustraited and quite before long as he would not have the mental and physical maturity as well as the experience to compete in that situation even though he obviously had the natural ability to become a super star.
Jordon obviously was put in the right situations, at the right stages, with mentors and coaches who understood the game, how to recognize natural talent, and how to mold and develop that natural talent and ability.

In my opinion the job and obligation of a houndsmen working and training a young super star is the same as those mentors and coaches that worked with Jordon during his learning curve. It is /was there job to bring that natural talent out through keeping the young prospect motivated by putting enough pressure on him to shape and mold that natural talent with out repeatedly putting him into a situation that he is not able to handle mentaly or physically. In my experience to much pressure is as bad or worse than not enough pressure. When dealing with young talent it is a balancing act for each individual. In my opinion, it is the handler's job to know where that line is between just enough pressure to mold and develope, and to much pressure. When you cross that line, you are going to be headed in reverse and cause alot of damage in a big hurry.

Josh

[bigboarstopper]

Most people who decide to start dogs usually wait till the dog shows maturity and good handling. Considering these things to be true, I just dont see a way to predict such an outcome.

I also understand how pushing a young dog can do a variety bad things. Ive seen it.
I just have a hard time seeing anybody who has a young superstar who knows the basic principals in starting young dogs predict a dog that will fizzle.

I tend to think that most of the time its "just one of those things".

[festus]

bigboarstoper,
I agree with you, I don't know that one would be able to predict with consistent accuracy which dog's will fizzle out, and which ones won't.
However, what I was trying to say was alot of promissing young hounds which show alot of drive, desire, and natural ability, early on and then go on to " Fizzle " out, alot of times handler error more than likely played a big part in that end result.

I also agree there are those impresive young dog's that for some unknown reason do just Fizzle out. I don't know the answer or reason for that, and if some one does I am all ears. I do know it is very easy to get excited and all jacked up about a very promissing natural young hound, and put to much pressure on him, and push him to hard, which alot of times will result in them fizzling out or shutting down on you. I have been there and done that more times than I care to admit.

[sourdough]

I guess I have to ask what most think is early starting? I have had many pups start trailing house cat around the house at 3-4 months and it’s hard not to think they wouldn’t go on to become super-stars with that much desire so early and then have all my hopes dashed when they hit a wall at a 1 1/2 and go on to be Average at best, in my opinion. I like a pup that progresses evenly and I can’t really explain it, as what each of us see’s in a dog might be quiet different but, all the lead dogs I have had had something special about them early on in their life. Acting on instinct and being a natural are two different things. I will agree that no one can predict the out come of what a pup might go on to become but, if one hunts the same strain of hound for year you should have a good idea what you will end up with. I agree that one can over do it with a pup. With that being said I have never been afraid of taking a young dog with me after they were big enough to at least keep up with me as there is more to learn about hunting than just tracking and treeing. Having a pup “fizzle” happens and I will always use the disclaimer when talking about a pup that is shining. Time will tell.

sourdough