Marking tracks?

Talk about Cougar Hunting with Dogs
snakerivercatman
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by snakerivercatman »

timothy wrote:I got no reason to fight with you on the internet snakerivercatman, I do wish however that I knew your "neck of the woods" it would be interesting to see how you spoke to me then. I wouldnt purposly dump on someone elses track but Im also not gunna run a lion because someone put a boot mark on it...

You're right Timothy, fighting on the internet is not the way to go about things. Besides, you've already shown your true colors, there's no arguing that.
snakerivercatman
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by snakerivercatman »

snakerivercatman wrote:
timothy wrote:I got no reason to fight with you on the internet snakerivercatman, I do wish however that I knew your "neck of the woods" it would be interesting to see how you spoke to me then. I wouldnt purposly dump on someone elses track but Im also not gunna run a lion because someone put a boot mark on it...

You're right Timothy, fighting on the internet is not the way to go about things. Besides, you've already shown your true colors, there's no arguing that.

PS..........meet me behind the monkey bars on the other side of the playground at 3:00!!
pegleg
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by pegleg »

I received a call from a older guy who sells a few hounds now and then he told me of a lion kill someone had reported to him "he said he found it" I thought this as damn nice of him. the next morning I rode in and hit the track before the kill trailed it out through the rocks hit a couple rough spots was really enjoying myself . riding along a ridge top i hear hounds on both sides one group I don't recognize so I decide to check it out and loop down and say hello. just started don and my hounds start treeing so I decide to Wait on the social call and head back . get to the canyon my hounds are in ride down a slide working my way to them. my hounds get pretty quiet then i hear a couple shots so i haul ass as fast as terrain will allow. now I am worried this wasn't an area i hunted much or knew many people from. I get there my hounds are looking around a few heading back. and my new found buddy is loading up a young tom with the help of two other guys. I'm not happy still got blood pounding in my ears. but I decide to be civilized and find out what exactly is going on here.
it turns out to be about the damnedest plan I've ever heard of. this guy has these two buyers on the line for started cat hounds at $2000 apiece and they won't buy till they see a cat. he knows the area and figures there's a chance he can watch me, drive around close and dump his hounds and hang back a little and wait for his chance to close the deal. these two are so excited they don't even care that his pups haven't even shown up. I told him that he is pulling a chicken shit stunt, he tells me of his hard times and how he needs the money so bad. I tell the buyers they should really consider what they are getting into and round up my hounds and get the hell out of there.
This is boldest most disgusting act of dog jocking I've ever seen. this area doesn't have much of a road system and he is to old to walk in the hills but there's one ranch trail leading to the top that v's and goes down the back side and he was desperate enough to try it. I talked to the warden afterwords and he tells me this guy has some friends that had put a tracking collar on a lion in the same area a year before and were using it as a pup trainer/dog seller.
ever since I've been overly nervous about hunting near other hunters. it's been years but i still wonder whose hounds would have been sold if i hadn't shown up? I've met many great houndsmen but that one was enough to leave a bad taste in anyone's mouth. since then I've heard other stories and seen some of his attempts at selling hounds it makes me try even harder to show folks few houndsmen are like that.
I rambled on hoping to show that if we act unsportsmanlike it affects all houndsmen. I know he has sold a good many dogs over the years and doubt many were what he claimed and can only guess at some of the methods he used. and undoubtedly many beginners got burnt along with that many more in the general public probably heard about the shady dealings of the hound world. duck hunters don't claim a duck before it's in range and if your not trailing a lion i can't see you have much claim to it. my opinion
ps my w button doesn't always work and this was a damn long post so fill them in if missing :oops:
bob baldwin jr
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by bob baldwin jr »

Pegleg: That is the type of guy us hounders DON't NEED :evil: I always reccommend that guys stay AWAY from Hound Jockeys .NOT ethical at all .Not sure of your state laws but how can someone live trap and collar any wild critter for their own PERSONAL training use :?: I know in Maine if you were caught doing that the warden service would have your ASS in the SlAMMER . I know it creates a lot of other issues but it is about time we started publishing names of those to stay away from and those that use un-ethical means of conducting business :x
pegleg
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by pegleg »

it's not legal or ethical. the game department occasionally tries to pick up on those signals but its been years and I'm not sure if they are still doing it. however all collars are traceable to purchaser. so be real careful who you sell old collars too
doghunter
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by doghunter »

Where we hunt if someone marks a track (any kind of track) and you put on it, it is big trouble.

We don’t have much trouble with someone running our tracks we don’t even stomp them out. People will drive by and look at them and that is about it. But it works both ways if i find a marked track where i usually run it is just tough I should have been up a little earlier. I would say we are lucky but some of the stories about the people that put on tracks marked by someone else are pretty harsh.

An old timer once told me to only mark what you can put on by 10:00 (he would mark 3 tracks) and he said after Noon he considered all tracks free game.

I do think it is wrong to put on some one eleses track. I know they dont own it but neither do you.

It is the same in my book as showing up with 3 fast pack dogs that will go to a barking dog and turning them out down the road knowing they will go to someone elses trail dog. Then once jumped whose game is it. (Better hope your trail dogs can keep up with the no talent speed demons or at the first road you cross it will be his 3 and yours will come after and he will want you to catch yours. (and i bet his story will be his dogs jumped and yours broke to his)

on the flip side if you stomp every track knowing you can run them all that is being a game hog.

I guess it all comes down to "do unto others"
timothy
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by timothy »

My true colors? there are so many flaws to makring a track with a bootmark to begin with. It could be anybody getting out of their vehicle just to look at the track. Im not going to waist my day because you think its ok to mark a bunch of tracks on the mountain then expect me to not put my dogs out.. I dont even understand why this is irritating me since I hunt private land, but one day i might find myself out on public ground and if you think Im gunna be scared of a few idle threats of what might happen to me you got another thing coming. I Am on several forums for different types of hunting and I have never seen a more selfish/whiney group of people. Im gunna refrain from talking on these topics anymore.
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by houndnem »

[quote="doghunter"]Where we hunt if someone marks a track (any kind of track) and you put on it, it is big trouble.

An old timer once told me to only mark what you can put on by 10:00 (he would mark 3 tracks) and he said after Noon he considered all tracks free game.

I do think it is wrong to put on some one eleses track. I know they dont own it but neither do you.

It is the same in my book as showing up with 3 fast pack dogs that will go to a barking dog and turning them out down the road knowing they will go to someone elses trail dog. Then once jumped whose game is it. (Better hope your trail dogs can keep up with the no talent speed demons or at the first road you cross it will be his 3 and yours will come after and he will want you to catch yours. (and i bet his story will be his dogs jumped and yours broke to his)

on the flip side if you stomp every track knowing you can run them all that is being a game hog.[=quote"doghunter

I agree 100% with this post. that's how I have always done it. there are many factors to consider. maybe they cut the track and want to cut the next road over to make sure they are on the shortest end of the track. or maybe they cut on wheelers and snowmobiles like me and they haveto go back to their truck to get dogs. give em a couple hours and if they don't show up to run it then dump away.I've had this happen to me quit a few times and it always ends up in a fist fight.I think the problem is alot of people where I hunt only catch a few lions all year so when they see a track they think this might be their only chance to get er done and they will do anything to be able to dump on it. even if it's a female with kittens.
Last edited by houndnem on Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by B&T man »

cougarhound wrote:
Yard Dog wrote:Gentleman?.....what is a gentleman?

Is a gentleman someone who gets up a 2:00 a.m (or earlier) after a fresh snow, leaves his dogs and buddys at home, cuts 3-4 drainages (and everywhere in between), stomps out (or leaves bootmarks) at every track he crosses and expects to be able to return sometime before 11:00 a.m. with his dogs and buddys to run one of these tracks (who knows which one) and expects all other houndsmen who might have wanted to get their mutts of a chain to step aside? Yea, a real gentleman indeed.

Raise your hand if your a real gentleman hu?....I guess I'll keep my hands down.

Jumping tracks when you know another hunter is trying to box it and cut it fresher is wrong, but so is driving around all night trying to tie up large hunting areas just by stomping or leave bootmarks at every track you cross. Seems like to me that a few guys would like to push this "unwritten rule", that is as long as they are the beneficiary. I would bet these same guys would be squilling like stuck pigs if they were on the other end of this "but I left bootmarks" rule.
Bottom line, if your not activly trying to cut it fresher or am not willing to put a dog down, YOUR LOSS. Any houndsmen that thinks all others should wait around while he goes home to get his dogs and buddys, or just to see if he can find a better cat to run is a ASS anyway. JMO

+1


+1... ? Thats how your crew hunts every day. Yesterday in fact.. I know because I hunt with one of your buddies. Thats how the kootenays hunt. Standard practice. :shock:
Some guys run Hounds to hunt Lions and Bears.... I hunt Lions and Bears so I can run Hounds!
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by rebel2 »

+1 to B&Tman.IM a memebr on a different site but i know 3 of the guys in this thread. South country is the worst area to hunt cause of local pressure. sparwood and cranbrook boys meeting in the middle. The reason why guys go so early here is cause of the pressure. I went there yesterday and was beat on 75 % of the roads and i was out at 430. I even had a road to myself and one guy followed me for 3 kms cause he thought i was going to fast and was going to miss a track......................... seems wrong to me no???? This is why we leave at 4 am cause there is to many unethical ppl out there, not to own the mountain or run 14 tracks. I personally will run a tom or a possible before i run a female. i gave those guys 2 tracks yesterday I didnt care and why should I??? But I should' nt have to worry about being trash talked. Im not calling the guys form yesterday unethical at all, Im just saying that there are ppl that are. The guy that followed me, I knnow who he is and we still talk, But ppl are so sick of getting screwed and burned around that we are all doing some stupid stuff. Nuff said.
GETTERDONE
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by GETTERDONE »

If you aint first your last, track is on the ground its yours as long as theres no sighn of dogs allready on it.
IF YOU AINT FIRST YOUR LAST!
sourdough
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by sourdough »

I will state my opinion and only my opinion so lets get that clear so there is know misunderstanding! In new fallen snow that has been un-molested. Marking tracks is like falling a tree across the road behind you, It's all meant to tie up the ground. It's a track, so lets mark it, all for the sole purpose to allow yourself the opportunity to run a track if you don't find a better one. No different than a guy marking water holes with tree stands during archery season. I have even seen stakes with guys names written on them on trails leading to a dirt tank. Walk to the dirt tank and see nothing there, but a dirt tank. I have seen so many trail cameras set up in a high game area it would make your head swim, "real" sportsman pulling cards from trail cameras and copying them onto a device and erasing the card. Can you claim a B&C record bull elk just because you have him on a photo in an area? This whole topic is BS! I will say again if you want to run a track then turn out on it, if not move on, if you turn out and think it might cross a road, then beat foot around to it and wait, if some one has shortened the track up ahead of you then catch your hounds up and move on. I will guarantee if it's a trophy, I will let the hounds shorten that track up and then stand guard over it's travel against some of the hyenas that write on this forum. All this crap takes place, then people bitch, then the game departments placed one more law on the books, go figure. Most all of them other than safety boil down to ethics. IF YOU CAN'T POLICE YOURSELF, THEY WILL!

Marking tracks is BS! Turning in on a guys race will cause your health insurance to go up! Those that care only about the catch have little regard for their hounds, their sport, or their future. Live for to day, to hell with tomorrow! When the use of a great companion hound has been reduced to bench shows and field trials with drags. The true houndsmen will still be running that hound.

The future of the trail hound and all hunting is based on your actions! Why not give those future outdoorsmen the tools to carry on with these woodsmen skills?

These game department won't turn around and give a test on hound dog safety,and ethics it will be gone...

I will care! will you!



Sourdough
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by Idaho Bison »

I agree with most of what you said except the part about turn out if you want. Where I live we have to worry about wolves and often we might want to look around to make sure we aren't turning out dogs where wolves are present. It's like you said Police ourselves but be respectful.


sourdough wrote:I will state my opinion and only my opinion so lets get that clear so there is know misunderstanding! In new fallen snow that has been un-molested. Marking tracks is like falling a tree across the road behind you, It's all meant to tie up the ground. It's a track, so lets mark it, all for the sole purpose to allow yourself the opportunity to run a track if you don't find a better one. No different than a guy marking water holes with tree stands during archery season. I have even seen stakes with guys names written on them on trails leading to a dirt tank. Walk to the dirt tank and see nothing there, but a dirt tank. I have seen so many trail cameras set up in a high game area it would make your head swim, "real" sportsman pulling cards from trail cameras and copying them onto a device and erasing the card. Can you claim a B&C record bull elk just because you have him on a photo in an area? This whole topic is BS! I will say again if you want to run a track then turn out on it, if not move on, if you turn out and think it might cross a road, then beat foot around to it and wait, if some one has shortened the track up ahead of you then catch your hounds up and move on. I will guarantee if it's a trophy, I will let the hounds shorten that track up and then stand guard over it's travel against some of the hyenas that write on this forum. All this crap takes place, then people bitch, then the game departments placed one more law on the books, go figure. Most all of them other than safety boil down to ethics. IF YOU CAN'T POLICE YOURSELF, THEY WILL!

Marking tracks is BS! Turning in on a guys race will cause your health insurance to go up! Those that care only about the catch have little regard for their hounds, their sport, or their future. Live for to day, to hell with tomorrow! When the use of a great companion hound has been reduced to bench shows and field trials with drags. The true houndsmen will still be running that hound.

The future of the trail hound and all hunting is based on your actions! Why not give those future outdoorsmen the tools to carry on with these woodsmen skills?

These game department won't turn around and give a test on hound dog safety,and ethics it will be gone...

I will care! will you!



Sourdough
Last edited by Idaho Bison on Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by B&T man »

sourdough wrote:This whole topic is BS! I will say again if you want to run a track then turn out on it, if not move on, if you turn out and think it might cross a road, then beat foot around to it and wait, if some one has shortened the track up ahead of you then catch your hounds up and move on. I will guarantee if it's a trophy, I will let the hounds shorten that track up and then stand guard over it's travel against some of the hyenas that write on this forum. All this crap takes place, then people bitch, then the game departments placed one more law on the books, go figure. Most all of them other than safety boil down to ethics. IF YOU CAN'T POLICE YOURSELF, THEY WILL!

Marking tracks is BS! Turning in on a guys race will cause your health insurance to go up! Sourdough


Marking tracks is a good thng.. Goes like this... 6:00 am hey a track.. oh some one marked it and they are working this track.. I'll carry on instead of waisting my time... Some one beat me fair and square because I slepped in.. Early bird gets the worm I guess. If a guy stated turning out on marked tracks all the time you'd gain alot of enemies real quick. Enemies you really do't want. If a track is marked late in the morning, I'll drive around to re-cut If I'm sure it's not being run I'll turn out. Also a track should be marked with more than just a boot print for sure.
Some guys run Hounds to hunt Lions and Bears.... I hunt Lions and Bears so I can run Hounds!
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Re: Marking tracks?

Post by rebel2 »

+1 If IM gonna run a track I leave more then a boot print. A timmies coffee cup to be exact. Anyone on here knows themselves that if you cut a track you really wanna run your gonna work it or your gonna be back at daylight to run it or your gonna sleep on it. I go out at 4am so I dont have to look at someones tail lights all morning. 9 times outta 10 I run one track im not greedy, dont have to be. Ive given away more tracks this year to ppl that i will never hunt with then Ive ran this year. Y cause thats the way it should be. I think d_c_j was only asking how guys merely mark a track to say hey im gonna come back and run this one, not to say "Screw you Im greedy and Im gonna take every track I can find!!!" JMO. I have a headache now from reading this.........................
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