The One!

[Warner5]

The natural, Cat minded, Cat footed, Cat dog. The One that we should all be keeping a keen eye for. You guy's that have been around a bit know what I'm talking about.

My question is how do they do it? I know the word fast comes to mind, but a dog like this never seems to be running as hard or fast as other dogs. Pressure also comes to mind but alot of dogs can pressure a cat only to watch the cat get away. A dogs timing is the biggest factor for me when choosing a cat dog, but it also needs some thing else to be a great one.

I have 10 dogs out their right now, each of them are good enough to keep and good enough to catch cats. But not one of them is what I would call a cat dog. These are all cat breed dogs from around the country.

So I have my own theories(maybe a little crazy). But am curious what the rest of you think while pondering what makes a Natural cat dog. Breeding, Training, Environment? It could be anything. I look forward to reading the responces. Thank you. John.

[South Texan]

Warner5,
You ask"What makes a nautral cat dog. Breeding, training, environment?"

Yes, I think breeding has a lot to do with it. Training has whole lot to do with it. Environment, just as long as you have cats to run in that environment.

But I think the one special thing that sets aside that special or "natural" cat dog is his ability to think. I haven't had to many of these special dogs but the ones that I did have all had this trait. I have seen them trying to figure out a trail from a pee spot. They could smell where the cat peed on the bush but the trail was just to cold to trail it. But these natural cat dogs would swing in deep searching for a movable trail, if that didn't work, I've seen them fall back out in the road look one way then another and take off in certain direction looking for the trail and keep doing this until they found it. But I mean you could see the wheels a turning in their head, trying to figure out where that cat went. They wasn't depending on anyone but their self to find that trail away from there.

Three years ago, during the south Texas cat hunt. We had caught one cat and had started our second cat. The dogs had started up ahead of the truck on an old fence line and took the trail to the right. They trailed in there 300 hundred to 400 hundred yards to the right, the wind was blowing terrible so we pulled down the fence line to the right to get closer to the dogs so we could hear'em. I think we had about 17 or 18 dogs total on the ground and 16 men in 4 different trucks. The dogs wasn't doing a whole lot with the trail, just opening ever now and then. As we was standing beside the truck listening to the dogs, all of a sudden you could hear a dog running down the road on the opposite side of the fence from us coming towards us. This dog's name was Matt and as he went by he never checked. Somebody asked "What dog was that' I answered "Matt." He asked "What's he doing?" I answered "I don't know"(at that time). Then as he got back behind us down the fence line where they had started the cat, he went to cutting lose (never said a word before this). Other dogs went to hearing him, come back and went to putting in and went on to catch the second cat.

But I told story to say this, when Matt was in there 3 or 400 hundred yards the wrong way and he finally figured out that the trail was backwards, there wasn't ANYTHING getting in his way to get back to the other end of that trail. When he went by 16 men a standing there talking and four trucks, it's like he never even saw us. He was FOCUSED on one thing and that was getting to the other end of that trail.

But anyway, to me, it is that REAL thinker in the bunch with the desire to catch that makes that natural or special cat dog. My experiences. Robbie

[Unreal_tk]

I have not seen enough dogs to know, but from what south texan has said. I would definitely agree with him. Mediocre dog on speed, drive, and everything else but has brains enough to figure out that cat is jumping poles to avoid the dogs, or the cat jumping rock ledges to get ahead, or the cat jumped tree to tree and walked down a log (not talking a treed cat here but just low trees), or the cat who runs down the pick up track, etc will be that best dog of yours. One thing that I saw in a dog once, was a unusual agility to get into tight spots, and move quickly over logs and etc. That trait there I think would be a good one on the list.

Another question with the brains, texan hit on it. Will all those great dogs like that, are they smart enought to always turn the track around if on the ass end. Just curious if that would be a common denominator.

[Warner5]

Thanks for the replies guy's, Robbie have you ever hunted with a dog that flanks the cat and the other dogs? attempting to head the cat off or turn it back towards the other dogs? Thanks. John.

I have seen 2 dogs that have done this fairly regularly with good results. They would be silent while working independent. 300 yrds would be about as far as they would work circling the other dogs, looking for the cat, putting a perfect jump on it.

Ending up with a dog like this these days would be a tough order. My first instinct would be to buzz or zap a dog doing this. Some times we are our own worse enemy's. John.

[South Texan]

Unreal-th.
In my post above when Matt turned that track around, I mentioned it was windy but also very dry and bare ground conditions. Conditions when a dog has a hard time figuring out the front end from the back end. BUT...when he did figure it out, he KNEW he had the back end. If I had to make a guess, I would say 90 to 95% of these natural cat dogs that is this smart does have the ability to turn the trail around. That's what separates them from the average dog, "SMART", so they have the mentality to figure things out. So...it could be a common denominator.

Warner5,
You ask,"Have you had dogs that would flank a cat or dogs, attempting to head the cat off or turn it back towards the dogs?" I hate to admit it, but yes I have. But I think it was more so to get to the front of the pack. I had a dog called Scogo, he was one of the biggest cheaters I ever saw. The places I hunted regularly, Scogo knew every road or sendero on the place. Nine times out of ten if you had the dogs running a cat towards where you was watching in a road and you saw the cat cross, Scogo would come flying down the road and I mean you better get out of the way he wasn't stopping for nothing and he would cut the trail ahead of the other dogs, to become lead dog. I don't think I have ever seen another dog turn as fast as Scogo could when he hit the spot where the cat crossed the road. He wouldn't overrun that spot 10 feet and I mean running all out, and turn back through himself like a cutting horse to get on the track. These cats crossing the roads are just the ones I saw but he would do it on the sides or flank as well. He was a cheater but he sure helped me catch some that I might not have caught without him. Now when he was doing this cheating, you would never hear a bark out of him till he cut the track ahead of the other dogs. Wish I had one of these cheaters in my pack right now, but I don't. My experiences. Robbie

[Warner5]

I am glad to hear someone else has seen this and thought the same thing. When I was a kid 15-20, I had a dog that would do this with amazing results. At that time, I had no idea what I was seeing. Just a dog catching cats, isnt that what a cat dog is susposed to do? But as I've gotten older I have learned to appreciate those WOW, how did that dog do that, dog. I have spent much time thinking about it, and it does seems obvious the dog is just cheating for the lead. But for me those dogs pulled it off way to many times with the end result being a cat in the tree. Those dogs seemed to have an intuition to where the cat was going and made treeing cats seem easy most of the time. I also wish I had a dog like that here right now. Thank you. John.

[timothy]

I am no expert but I know my father in law was blessed enough to have several cat dogs. And the common trait in all of them was their intelligence. Their ability to comprehend what was happening around them.

[mike martell]

I think a guy can get caught up in having too many dogs....I know several guys who have a great deal of success running 8-10 dogs on cats...Dogs can learn a great deal from dry ground cat hunting even with large packs and not just running covered tracks....

I make em one at a time and could care less about strengths....I concentrate on weakness and holes in each dog...some holes I can't deal with and make adjustments....strong points tend to themselves...the same weakness times two or three the same in your dogs will sink your ship....I think if you have a Yard full of dogs it is real hard to single out a dog and finish out into the style dog you want to hunt...

I have always been a believer of making as complete of dog as possible before adding another dog to the mix...I have never owned over six hounds in over forty years at one time and never been without a complete hound....as long as I have one dog, I'm hunting...Bobcats aren't as hard to catch as hound hunters make them out to be....They are elusive but not impossible to catch with one hound....how can a guy start with one young dog and catch a bobcat without a trained hound? how can a dog rig a track from top the truck without a rig dog to train it?...... Sure it is easier with one solid broke trained hound....most of the time this is the problem....you become complacent owning old ace

With cat dogs you better set the bar high or you are not going to see much sitting in trees.....Top dogs are out there, you just have to know when to cut and run or cut em loose

Start with a cat bred line of hounds and make them do what you want them to do....finish one dog and add the next...leave your best dog home and go hunting or single them out as much as possible, something 99% of the hound hunters will not do, they have old ace in the hole and when he dies....They are looking for a cat dog to buy with a yard full of hounds that could have been the next ace if only they singled them out and made them do it all by themselves.....

[live to hunt]

Great post Mike!

[timothy]

Mike I cant imagine turning 10 dogs loose! much less spending the money on all that upkeep.

[Warner5]

I cannot agree more with you mike, working with 1 or 2 dogs at a time makes the dogs do it all, they cannot rely on another dog. I also believe less dogs gives the dogs on track time to figure the problem out without being pressured or distracted they do it all through trial and error.

I have 10 dogs but I alternate, 1 to 5 dogs is all I will work at once. More than that I feel they dont get enough from the hunt. Thank you. John.

[mike martell]

Owning and hunting ten dogs is alot of work....You better have your ducks in a row or you can have a serious train wreck...Mark on here has a bunch of dogs he hunts on Bobcats with a great deal of success...His inspiration was Elmer Blankinship with a pile of dogs on a bobcat....You think bear dogs make some racket....bobcat dogs wanting to catch are something to listen too....One day I had a list of dogs and collars with the tri-tronics that i run on every dog i hunt.....No more list for me....once the tri-tronics is full at six....done...no more dogs!

I just can't imagine spending 30 minutes collaring and uncollaring dogs, too much like a day job!!!!....the care and maintenance....the you name it....but when you have them firing.....look out a cat is going to climb, fly or ouch...When me and my son hunt together we have five hounds total between us and does it sound sweet to hear them trail and jump a bobcat!

[mike martell]

John....I got you on splitting up your dogs, Good plan!....I always find myself looking for the answers and will not quit until I feel confident things played out like I think they should from hunt to hunt....Here is what I find.... By hunting large numbers of dogs, I feel like I have neglected select dogs or situations that I know I should tend too but just didn't because I was distracted by numbers...

Take Care Guys.

Mike Martell

[dwalton]

To make a top cat dog he or she has to have it all, brains first, ability to run a tack fast[ that does not mean a fast dog. Most fast dogs will over run to much], heart, desire, ability to be trained, a good handler and lots of cat hunting. That's asking a lot but I feel it is what it takes to make a top dog. They can learn more by doing it themselves but will still stand out being hunted in a pack. I compare it to Olympic Athletes, we don't see one often but boy we know it when we do. So with that said, we hunt and work with what we have waiting for a top one to show up. It would be nice to see what it means to you all to call a dog a top cat dog. To me it is a dog that will out cold trail and strike most dogs that it is hunted with. Complete 80% of the tracks it starts, and only fails to tree maybe 1 or 2 bobcats that it jumps all year hunting in all conditions all year around. How many of you have had the privilege to hunt with such a dog? Dewey

[Unreal_tk]

We all agree intelligence is a major factor here, now here's a question. Is that intelligence with the dog from birth, or is it like some dogs who flip a switch to be gamey. I have my own theory but I am interested to responses.