bobcats in the rocks

[twist]

Who has dogs that consistantly catch cat in the rocks? Lets here about them dogs. Andy

[al baldwin]

Andy there are lots of big rocks scattered thru most of the landscape in a majority of areas we hunt, those rocks create looses, making it tough to catch some of the cats that live to become dog wise in this area. Over time have sure caught some in the rocks, sure lost some in them also. Most time a cat that uses those rocks, will get caught in a piece of decent ground, perhaps when trying to reach another rock. Those rocks are very dangerous places for the hounds. Just stand to reason bobcats have the advantage when they stay in those rocks. Thinking back, the hound I used to have a ton on respect for in his ability to walk those small ledges, me knowing if he slipped probably meant the end for him, was the Rowdy hound. In his prime rowdy was a 55 lb. athletic hound, never certain who sired him, but for sure was a product of hounds with mostly coon hound breeding behind them. Rowdy could also clear a four foot woven wire fence with a couple strands of barb wire on top, with the grace of a deer. Rowdy also threw several pups who possessed his grace. Just my experience. Al

[david]

Great question Andy. I will be all ears on this one. We have caught "rock cats" but in our experience, we need to hit the track going away from the rock ledges, and we need to catch him fast. It has not been hard to do if we can get him out of his element. but if we find a track heading in to the rock ledges that no dog could maneuver without wings, we just keep looking for other tracks. We would not turn out on it unless trying to challenge some pups and make them work for their supper or unless we feel he is right there, and he might pop up.

If you bring out someone who consistently catches educated bobcat out of the ledge country with open mouthed dogs it is something I would pay good vacation or guide money to see.

I know there are areas where guys have learned the ONLY way to get them with dogs is with silent dogs. And I know how most people on here feel about that (eg "might as well use traps"), but I have trapped a lot of animals in my life, and i disagree with those people. I would love to hear about folks outsmarting the ledge cats with silent dogs. Would love to witness it also!

[dwalton]

Dogs will lose a lot of cats in the rocks. It take a fast track dog to get those cats in rim rock country. I have owned a few dogs that were good at it and they usually they die in them also. I have a couple of those dogs now that I ran in the rims in northeastern California. If in rim country I usually just run the two dogs that are tight on a cold trail but open on a jump. The fast push on the jump is what trees them. I have lost some in holes but have treed or caught on the ground more than I holed. The country is rims 15 to 50 feet tall about 400 to 600 yards apart. I have killed several that the dogs locate in the bluffs, usually one baying from the top and one from the bottom. Using binoculars to spot the cats. I hunt here in Oregon more country with bluffs than most of the hunters because they choose not to hunt it. For me cat country is rough rocky country. It will usually hold more cats and is not hunted as hard. Some dogs work well in rocky country some don't. Watch your dogs some get around a lot better in that type of country. The ones that don't should be left in the rig they will educate the cats and get in the way of a good dog doing it's job. Dewey

[mike martell]

Generally there is a reason for guys staying away from areas with bluffs and lava flows. I get a chuckle from many areas I hunt by looking at the tire tracks that get about a half mile from the rock piles and turn around..... I tend to find the most cats in these areas beyond and hunt them strategically on the East side and try my best to stay completely away on the west side of the State. I find if you keep at it, you will catch your share. Some dogs only serve to educate the cats while some have the knack of figuring it out. I have to admit, with my big screaming mouth hounds, I'm educating my share...

One thing stands clear. Prior to the Oregon ban, I hunted the same ground for bobcats now as bear back prior to 1994 in Western Oregon and can tell you after hunting the same country, I discovered all the bluffs bobcat hunting...Not sure I ever had a clue those bluffs even existed prior to bobcat hunting....I traveled to many new locations across Oregon this winter just exploring new areas and discovered if I found a cat in the timber in an accessible area, it was because the cat was heading for the bluffs unbeknown to me a short distance away....I have been forced to hunt the more open country in Central and Eastern Oregon for health reasons and know most of the places I hunt very well, the places I hunt have plenty of lave caverns and large lave flow fields and find this to be a safe haven for the bobcats.

I find hunting these areas to be extremely challenging and populated with more bobcats than other locations for obvious reasons and more fun. I would rather have a tough challenge and get beat than drive for hours on end looking for a track to run. When you understand the terrain and geography lay out it becomes clear where these bobcats are going and what they are up too and helps to even the playing field. Those high desert cats travel between these buttes. Most of this country is heavily timbered and I strive to find them traveling between those safe havens. If you can cut a track coming out of the lava flows and know where you are and can get them jumped in the timber and put enough heat on them, they tree.

Sometimes those cats are accustomed to the bark of the hounds that serves as a cue to high tail it for the rocks. As you would guess, having open mouth hounds gives the cat the advantage and Like David mentioned previously, why I hunt hounds. I missed several cats by a short distance this winter with open mouth hounds that I'm sure the outcome would have been different with more silent mouth dogs. I would love to see for myself if a guy hunted those type dogs if the catch ratio went up...I bet they would and once established? I really don't have enough interest in catching to want to find out....

I would get bored quick and abandon that quest for the race and continue to further educate those cats for future breeding stock. Prior to Garmin, I lost my dogs on many occasions in those lava flow caverns. Now if you have three or four dogs and drop the signal all about the same time and location, you can at least walk in to where you dropped your gps signal and figure out where your dogs disappeared.

Mike

[U.R.E.]

Lots of great info that further supports the diversity of the "Forest Ghost"
These are some of the areas we have found ourselves dealing with of the past year.

The dogs would disappear under these rocks then reappear up to 60-80 yards away. You can see how massive these boulders are compared to my son, who is no little gripper.
This was the second time we found ourselves in these rocks. The first time there was 5 feet of snow covering them -13 degrees out and it was dark. The third time the cat got treed at the very top of the hillside (32lb tom).


This gives you an idea how vast this hillside is.


This clip shows the other kind of rock we find ourselves in, on, and around as a cat hunter. Just 8-10 feet behind this tree is a straight 500ft face. To the right is a massive 1000ft face. The ridge leading to this point was about 2ft wide for about 100yds. with a shear face on one side and a broken face on the other. It took me about 45 minutes to get to them and an hour and a half to get out. Like Mike M. mentioned "I never would have guessed they existed"

http://youtu.be/LluSOgRCLM4

Safe hunting to all who pursues these little rascals, Don

[al baldwin]

Nice pictures Don. Over the years the few cats I/ve caught in any rocks like that, I figured I was a bunch lucky. Do recall a cat I had ran numerous times that always went to a dangerous rock pile in a real rough place, finally one day I thought I would just walk in and get them at the rock. Surprise they had treed in a large fir at the base of the rock & had the cat. Only two dogs, both were a little tight mouthed at times. David nothing wrong with tight mouth dogs if one likes that, sure there are times when a few extra critters will get got that would escape open mouthed. However I owned some tight mouth hounds that also had a tough time on some cat. Of coarse, total silent trailers bound to sneak up on some. Al

[twist]

In my experiances if the rocks are something the cat cnt keep in and can be pushed out they can be caught but in rocks that are never ending for the cat its a no win game for the dog or dogs. Thete is just no dog that can manuver in the rocks like a cat and keep enough presure to put one up. Have also caught a fair share of them headed to the rocks and tree and all they would have had to do is make one more leap and they would have hadsafety. Great storis guys. Andy