Running dogs that tree

Bones2 · Post by **Bones2** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 4:44 pm

Anyone breeding any running dog crosses that are still natural tree dogs, these pure bred hounds dont have enough track and go to them to make cat dogs anymore.

mike martell · Post by **mike martell** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:13 pm

Bones2 wrote:Anyone breeding any running dog crosses that are still natural tree dogs, these pure bred hounds dont have enough track and go to them to make cat dogs anymore.

Yes, and you don't need to look beyond your home State...Just check references first!

I don't own a full hound and never will again, that said...Good luck! Some of the California guys pioneered the running dog cross long before most guys in Oregon got on the band wagon...This is a process of trial, error and elimination and well worth the efforts...Once you find the right combination? you will quit hunting full hounds on anything you want to pursue...I'm pretty hard to please, not to mention hard headed and watched the running dog cross and enough of the hounds for me....It don't take much running blood to start taking away from treeing (not all cases are the same, I have seen many running dogs tree better than hounds)...I want dogs to advance the track first and tree second....You can't tree on what you can't catch or start!

This is the cool thing about hounds, you can never perfect your objective, and if you can keep an open mind? The potential is limitless!

Good Luck!

Mike

twist · Post by **twist** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 5:33 pm

I will have to say there are some dang nice running dog crosses and thevones I have seen do a good job on the tree. But if one does the research there are pure breds that have plenty of go and track speed along with jump speed to catch bobcat along with the best of them. Andy

Clyde Lawson · Post by **Clyde Lawson** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 6:50 pm

Bones2 wrote:Anyone breeding any running dog crosses that are still natural tree dogs, these pure bred hounds dont have enough track and go to them to make cat dogs anymore.

There are breeders of "bobcat hounds" in Oklahoma that do have running hounds that tree. The next questions you have to ask is what type of hunting country will you be hunting? My full blood Running Walker hounds will tree in SW Oklahoma & South Texas, but in SE Oklahoma with big pine trees, may be another story! They will be at tree with the hounds treeing, but not saying much? I don't think they locate the cat cause on getting to the tree and while searching for the cat, they will sometimes start treeing and be looking at the cat at that time!

Have two Trigg and one Treeing Walker/Trigg--all less then 2 years down to one year old that are running with pack & sometimes on Garmin seems they are at the head of race. When cat is treed, they are not treeing but staying at tree with older hounds looking? Soon ( I hope) they will start putting it together.

Crossed Reg Treeing Walker(I raised and old foundation breeding) over a Reg. Trigg Female (From Full Cry Trigg Kennels Breeding)---Progeny are 1 yr. old and all have been reported as doing great. Some of the litter is and has been treeing for while, but my male is not at this time. However, in hunt this week, he rigged bobcat on his own! Stayed in race for 1 hr. plus and was there when cat was caught on ground. That was about 11-12 cat races he has been involved with.

Contact me & I can provide some cat hunters in area that may have some cross breds or straight running bred that may work for you? There will not be many available.

Another note, many in this area and further East, do not what the hounds treeing cause they cannot get to them due to water or rough terrain. They just enjoy the race and want to "honk" or call them back when race is finished.

Clyde
918-850-3421
ccwawson@aol.com

dwalton · Post by **dwalton** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 11:07 pm

I would like to put some tree back into my part running dogs but have not been able to find some with the ability to move a track. If they can move a trailing track the jump is the easy part. What treeing walkers are bred to move a cold track Andy? I have try several and have not found the track style that works for me. Dewey

Bones2 · Post by **Bones2** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:39 am

I would love to be proven wrong on these purebred tree hounds, but i have not seen one in years that had all the tools to be a bobcat dog on brushy oregon coast.

al baldwin · Post by **al baldwin** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:47 am

How many have you hunted with? Al

mark · Post by **mark** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:16 am

eeeeeeeeeew this is gunna get good!

merlo_105 · Post by **merlo_105** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:17 am

There's plenty of people breeding running crosses that are natural tree dogs. There still straight hounds out there that can get it done. I would stay away from most the reg stuff myself. But look and see what the small time Walker guys or Blue tick guys and so on are doing. Most the dogs I have seen around here can move the track and catch but they are just piss poor at locating.

twist · Post by **twist** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:14 am

Dewey, the strain I am hunting move a cold track very well have them all over the country with good results and run heads up on the jump. Not saying they are any better than any other dog but when guys say full blooded hounds aren't out there that can run a cold track with style are very narrow minded. Andy

Clyde Lawson · Post by **Clyde Lawson** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 10:06 am

twist wrote:Dewey, the strain I am hunting move a cold track very well have them all over the country with good results and run heads up on the jump. Not saying they are any better than any other dog but when guys say full blooded hounds aren't out there that can run a cold track with style are very narrow minded. Andy

Your sure correct, in my opinion, about that. And I have always wanted to try your line of hounds here in my hunt area.

I went the Treeing Walker way with some old foundation breeding(Merchants Banjo, Houses Bawlie) six years ago. Had litter of six pups and they all were tree hounds. I kept those pups up to 1.5 years old and had only one that made my requirements for a bobcat hound. Remainder of litter are doing well today as coon hounds with other hunters but would not fit my program(those that have them still are feeding them). Now the one I kept is one my my main cat hounds and is being used for crossing out over my Running Walkers and Triggs.

He rigs, strikes, locates, & trees real well. Easy to handle will likely live out his life in my kennel. His FAULT---sure wish he was a smaller type hound! And after 3-5 hard(2 hour)races he is finished for 3-4 days. Where as the Running Cross or straight breds will still be going!

Always looking for the perfect bobcat hound & not sure there is one? But when I feed them as the saying goes, I can fault them! For sure my pack has many that can be faulted!

BUT--in saying that above--from Thurs night of this last week, rigged six bobs, had six good races, caught two on ground & lost rest on dusty forest roads. Good hunt and great time with my hounds!

Thanks & come hunt with me,

Clyde

mike martell · Post by **mike martell** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:44 am

Clyde Lawson wrote:
Thanks & come hunt with me,

Clyde

Quite possibly what has made the difference in the bobcat world today is what so many have done on this site like Clyde...The offer to come hunt and see with your own eyes.
I think this is what one other contributor meant when he said...You don't know what you don't know!

JMHO!
Mike

Bones2 · Post by **Bones2** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:38 pm

Twist Any of your dogs here on washington oregon coast that i may get some references on.

twist · Post by **twist** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:46 pm

My pickup door is always open to any hunter. I am one to go see for mysrlf have hunted many different area with some great hounds and hound crosses but when one says full blooded hounds aren't out there that can catch with the best of them are narrow minded in my eyes. Heck come hunt bring your best I always like to see a good dog work. I will say this though don't expect to have a bobcat around every corner or trot across the road in front of you and lace up your boots because the 15 minute COLD trails don't happen here very seldom and there isn't a good road system and bring some woolies not to many jean days here. Andy

Clyde Lawson · Post by **Clyde Lawson** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:12 pm

twist wrote:My pickup door is always open to any hunter. I am one to go see for mysrlf have hunted many different area with some great hounds and hound crosses but when one says full blooded hounds aren't out there that can catch with the best of them are narrow minded in my eyes. Heck come hunt bring your best I always like to see a good dog work. I will say this though don't expect to have a bobcat around every corner or trot across the road in front of you and lace up your boots because the 15 minute COLD trails don't happen here very seldom and there isn't a good road system and bring some woolies not to many jean days here. Andy

Twist,

Your correct again, I think, in that there are full blooded hounds out there that can get the job done!

Tried two hunts that were not that successful with my pack in different States. Two years ago spent some time with Mike Pierce in Duncan, AZ going to attempt to show Mike how my Running Hounds and Running Cross hounds would catch a bobcat? That did not work out well!

Could strike and move track in draws only & could smell enough to open under cedar bushes on ridges. But were doing what we refer to a "pecking around" on those cat tracks! Mike was gracious enough to say that my hounds did better then his did? Think he was being nice!

And then last year(I had forgot what I hated about snow & cold weather), I went to Salida, CO and hunted a week with Tim Morgan on bobcats. 5* below 0 when we spotted a bobcat cross the road in front of truck. Turned out on him and I had only two hounds that would even open on track. Some others would "flag" but could not get enough scent to open, & those two were walking only on track. They moved it maybe 250-300 yards in 45-60 minutes?

Point is: That same pack in SW OK, TX, KS, & AR where they are hunted more often will catch/tree number of bobs? Why not in other areas?

This is one of many reasons that running bobcats with hounds is such a challenge and myself and apparently many others find it so fascinating.

Take care,

Clyde

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