cold nosed

[scrubrunner]

To comment on Dewey's original post, I think nose should always be considered when breeding hounds. A lot of running dog lines in the east are now bred to compete in the enclosures where it is all about speed. I have tried several, hunting gray fox/cat on the outside, none worked out, nose/trailing ability practically nonexistent.
There are a lot of things to consider when breeding hounds but if nose/trailing ability is not close to the top of that list, it don't take long to lose it.
Nose and endurance has always been at the top of my list when breeding hounds, I'll weed through em to get the other things I like.

[david]

Scrubrunner, get you one of them scent receptor counters for puppies.

[1bludawg]

My pups noses usually develop with time and experience .Their nose seems to be fully developed at 2 years old but will get better with more hunting .After they peak at 3 years old I can't tell much difference after that .
Hot nose dogs peak early and don't seem to improve much .
That's been my experience anyway .

[scrubrunner]

David, I remember a couple of dog jockeys back in the day, bet they would have told me, they got one of those scent receptor counters and would sell it to me at a goooood price! Along with a butt wrench to open it up bigger to run bears or tighten it up to run smaller game.

[dwalton]

Thanks for the replies guys. A lot of thought goes into them. I have walked thousands of miles behind bobcat and lion dogs and always looked for cold nose dogs. I think dogs can learn to cold trail better with experience hunting with another dog as well as ability to move a cold track fast enough to catch it by how you hunt. I also believe it does not matter how many receptor a dog has if it does not have the other stuff that it takes to make a complete dog. It can be a eye opener to hunt with other people and see what they have and more important what they expect from their dogs, Good hunting Dewey

[davidg1!]

Thanks for the replies guys. A lot of thought goes into them. I have walked thousands of miles behind bobcat and lion dogs and always looked for cold nose dogs. I think dogs can learn to cold trail better with experience hunting with another dog as well as ability to move a cold track fast enough to catch it by how you hunt. I also believe it does not matter how many receptor a dog has if it does not have the other stuff that it takes to make a complete dog. It can be a eye opener to hunt with other people and see what they have and more important what they expect from their dogs, Good hunting Dewey

I agree, We need to look past the barn when we want pups.

[Cajun]

I know this is in the cat section, but this is a subject that has fascinated me for years & years. altho mainly a hog hunter & bearhunt when I can I have always given a lot of thought to coldnosed hounds. While I do think more experience helps a dog deveop his nose through exposure, I definently believe there are dogs born that just have it from the first time out & they too get better with practice.
You would probably think why somebody from La. in mostly swamp would need a cold nose dog but we have certain conditions here when it is very dry & trailing thru pine straw & cutover can be a challenge to a lot of dogs. I've hog hunted in Fla. & trailing thru a lot of sand can test a dogs nose. I would rather have a cold nose dog & not need it then to have a hot nose dog that can only trail 3 or 4 hour tracks.
I know there is a world of experience on this board & I am sure people have seen dogs trailing a bad track, struggling to move it, but there is that one dog that takes it & moves it out & gets it jumped. I dont know how much nose, brains or drive that dog has but I am sure it is a combination of all three. Give me the dog that gets the game jumped, no matter what the conditions are & speaking of conditions we all know what a important factor they play in trailing. For us it is high humidity with 80 degree plus temps. When I go up to Canada it seems like my dogs have no problem what so ever in trailing bear up in 50-80 degrees with lower humidity. I do not know anything about frozen in tracks or snow but water I do know about. as long as it is not running water I have seen dogs coldtrail across ponds, lakes & cypress swamp with no problems. I really think water holds scent & dogs used to water have no problem. Anyway a little of my ramblings. This is a great topic.

[david]

...there is that one dog that takes it & moves it out & gets it jumped. I dont know how much nose, brains or drive that dog has but I am sure it is a combination of all three.

I think you pretty much summed it up in three words Mike.

Not sure how you did it without a scent receptor counter though.

[david]

These same guys that count scent receptors (evidently) say that ears that drag on the ground are designed that way to stir up scent molecules. And the flews (baggy lips) and extra folds of skin are designed to capture and hold scent molecules.

also, the drooling is said to aid in a dogs ability to detect, freshen?, collect, hold scent molecules.

What do you guys think. Why are the best bobcat dogs I have known without the drooling, large flews and extra skin folds? Are we missing something by not breeding in these overt physical characteristics? Do dogs with these physical traits have to also be slow?

[1bludawg]

I have seen dogs scratch and lick on old cold tracks and i believe they were attempting to stir up some scent .As a side note i've never saw a hot nose dog do that .
As for the long ears,flews and droopy skin hounds i don't really believe that to be true.I've heard the same thing for years but i think whoever thought it up had to much time on their hands .Even if it were true its not necessary as some of the coldest nosed dogs i've hunted were short eared and tight made.
On the other hand i've seen those ole long eared,big houndy looking potlickers lead the pack on a hard running cat in any company .As i've said before the best predictor of what a dog will do are its parents and their ancestors.

[merlo_105]

I have one now that will lay her head side ways with the road trying to take up every little scent she can seen her lick the road a few times. Like 1bludawg said pick um by there breeding. Had a 3 1/2 month old pup out who was cranking on a old track and piss post the old dogs couldn't get off the road... Wonder if she's going to be cold nosed.....

[undertheradar]

The smaller, quicker dogs that yall say are hot nosed (only trail a 3 hour track) I'll take them off your hands. I don't have time to listen to a dog trail for 12 hours.

[dwalton]

It seems to me what some people think is cold nose[ smelling where they lick, digging the leaves, standing and going up and down a bush ect...] don't seem to be a productive way to tree game? Maybe the colder nose is not what we want in a cat dog? That said I feel as most of us that I have very folded nose dogs. Good hunting Dewey

[merlo_105]

Your probably right Dewey that doesn't sound like a very productive way to tree cats I would not own a dog who just sat around sniffed stuff and licked things. But when your banging around on Old tracks in this kinda heat with poor scenting conditions I'm ok if the dogs work it more methodical rather then start casting for the track and over running it. The dog's know what they need to do, we assume we know.

[LarryBeggs]

When I was a kid dad and I were hunting with a guy that had a big long eared droopy hided dog. We got a few tail wiggles and that dog opened right up and went to really working that track. Fist impression pretty cold nosed. About a minute later dad's dogs opened about 100 yards out and went to moving up the hill toward another road. By the time we got to that road dad's dogs were jumped crossed that road and shortly after were treed. We shot the cat out drove back to where we started the track and that dog was still trailing and hadn't even made it to where dad's dogs started opening. Had
to run the dog down and drag it back to the truck . Wasn't hard to do. So much for first impressions.