starting a rig dog

[chancemarquette]

I am new to the sport and have only lion hunted when it snows. Does anyone have any good tips to get a rig dog started and strike from the truck

[houndcrazyfool]

I'am curious to what some of these experts have to say about this topic also (without an older dog to show em)?
Myself, i am trying to get a couple dogs rigging without the help of an older rig dog. I do have a one year old that is starting to rig, mostly bear scent or a bear hide drag across a road... I've but bear scent on a rag and set it down wind off the road, drug a fresh bear hide across a road, set a trainer off the road, but really out of easy ideas other than some good old fasion riggin in the woods. Which i did today and the only thing she rigged was a big ol buck deer. I didnt want to whoop her too hard and take the riggin out of her so she got a swat and a tongue lashin. BUt that dog ;loves being on the rig so much she just whines (excited) the whole time...

[Ike]

There have been several people address this issue or training method over time on this board, and I did look back trying to find some of the comments last night without any luck. Lots of people have used coon, bear or lion scent to get those young dogs to open by setting a drag ahead of their path down the road. And it makes sense that a person would most likely speed up the process and shortcut a young dog into rigging the desired game. However, I have never personally done any of that......

When I started rig dogs it was trial and error, find a track and make them learn to cold trail. Then if no track was not found I'd drive into a spring or place I thought a lion or bear would visit and put the dogs down to hunt, then make them show me the track. The problem with that method is the elk or deer track and scent on the spring is always fresher than the lion or bear, and it is pretty damn hard to figure out what a hound is trailing before they are gone. Good rule of thumb is if the track is slow it's more likely a lion track and if it's fast it's more likely trash or a bear. But I always ran shock collars on those start dogs and made them show me the proof..........

Even today I stop when one or all my hounds start rigging and give them a chance to show me the meat. If they can't show me a track I often correct or scold them for it.

My thoughts on scent training is it's a good thing for a guy that is starting out and doesn't have a finished hound to help train that pup. However, running a scent drag or rigging hot scent off a tree or bush that you've put there is only the beginning, and that dog will have to make the jump from hot to cold or easy to tough down the road.

Don't know if that will help you any but good luck on the training and I hope it all works out for you..........

ike

[Bearhunter]

Rig dogs are born not made.If they have the nose and desire they will rig.

[Ike]

Not only are rig dogs made, good dogs are made as well...........

ike

[chancemarquette]

Thats what i believe ike well said

[briarpatch]

Both Rig dogs and "good" dogs.......some are natural and some are "made"..........rather have the natural...

briarpa tch

[Ike]

I had an old hounddogger once tell me, "if a young hound won't run hot deer and elk hard then he won't run lions or bears hard either."

Natural or not, a good trail dog is a good trail dog and it'll run whatever the trainer allows it to run. Therefore, according to my thinking, a lock down bear or lion dog was made whether it was a natural or not.........

ike

[briarpatch]

Ike, I respectfully disagree with your "old Hounddogger". I have certainly seen trashy young dogs turn out to be good trained dogs, but I have also seen a few that did not mess with trash hardly at all and made very good dogs (and pleasures to train and hunt).

I also disagree with you that a "natural" is a "made" dog. I have had about 3 "naturals" over the years and, outside of very light trash breaking, I take very little to no credit for their abilities.

I can assure you that I knjow a FEW dogs around the country today that meet my criteria for "naturals"

briarpatch

[Ike]

Had a few naturals myself but I sure don't give them all the credit for their success either. I'll tell you a little story..........

Years ago I picked up a pup that was a natural trail dog, wouldn't run trash and would bark down a dirt lion track like a veteran as a pup. An outfitter and I started a crappy tom lion track one year with his seven year old veteran bitch and a couple of mine. They hit the south side of that slope and had some trouble picking the track up the shale slope. I started that young dog of mine in behind and he parted those three older hounds and nailed that track (step for step) up that dry slope.

Now that was kinda of embarrassing for both of us you might say. I looked at my outfitter and told him, "I'll bet you never thought you'd see a yearling pup pick the track ahead of three veteran lion hounds huh?"

His reply was NO!

Now that pup had ran with those dogs since it was tit weaned and had been to the tree on nine lions already. Therefore, I'd say he was a natural and a track dog to boot.

Now back to the story...........

I talked to a guy back east who was taking care of a litter mate brother to that dog that had never been hunted. It seems he didn't coon hunt but had a bunch of July dogs and ran coyotes. He told me that the dog he had had never been hunted and needed put down. My point is that had either of those two litter mates ended up in my backyard they'd make pretty good trail dogs, yet the one was a natural and the other a cull...

In my opinion, lots of hounds have natural ability but the ones that float to the top find a home with a good hunter..............................

ike

[Darvin Ecklund]

Well said Ike-

I'm sure there is a lot of "Naturals" out there that got in the wrong hands and very well became "Culls" because of the hunter or lack of that they were paired up with. There is a lot to learn in this game and sometimes the only way to learn is through trial and error over and over and over again!