Biggest lion you caught

[liontracker]

Age, Nutrition, and genetics.

The big trump card in all of this is feed. If you got a critter that has access to large amounts of grub, it really has a chance to get big regardless of the region

Now we are getting somewhere! Mr. Mike has already posted on a 227lb. Arizona lion and the new CO state record weighed around 230lbs. Just because the "Ceiling" appears to be about 230lbs, do not doubt for very long, that there are not even bigger ones out there. When you have a lion population that almost totally subsists on diet of elk for 15-20 years, you will see more than your share of huge toms come out of it. Give them some security in the form of Private land and Reservations, then they will get the age on them to grow this big. As far as I can tell from harvest reports and tooth data, the average age of a male lion taken is 3 years old. Let them get to 9-10 yrs old and see what you get.

This is what is known around these parts, as a "Super Tom":

New Colorado State Record:

bwilliams_hold_lion.jpg (18.87 KiB) Viewed 4904 times

[Mike Leonard]

Liontracker you are right on feed, age and genticis. But as Shorty said big in one country where feed is scarce and living hard isn't the same when you have lions living to a ripe old age most of the time in protected areas with fat elk running all over.

That is probably the main reason the Boone and Crockett set up it's standards for cougars, jaguars and the bears by measuring the skull, nothing said about how long or how heavy. I have seen some skinny old desert lion that were old and they had ened up with B&C heads.

If you kill a five year old tom that makes 15" minumum all time remember that the boney ridge on the top of the skull continues to grow on lions even in old age and this will increase that measurment ever so slightly. But slight is all that seperated the number 10 in the world from page after page of all times that were just an 1/8" or even a 1/16" smaller.

[az_gogetem]

Az_gogetum,

Earlier in the year Warner, Kelly Glenn and I took out a hunter from back east. I was just tagging along to help in any way possible and learn as much as possible. Anyhow after six previously paid hunts this feller had only harvested a small female with another outfitter. Warner really wanted to get him a big tom as this would be the last hunt the old mans wife would allow him to go on. When all said and done we got him a large tom (for the area) on the first day of the hunt. I saw the disappointment in the guys eyes when he walked up to his big cat. He asked what he weighed as Warner, Kelly and I were bragging on this cat. When warner told him 130-135lbs he looked like someone let the air out of him.

Thanks shorty for making me feel better. I have a hunter that is dying to kill a lion. But he wants something comparable to the road kill tom that was posted on here, he got the email and he thinks that what all big lions look like. Sent him a few pictures of 15" and up toms did not tell him how big they were, he said he would have passed on them they were too small. Mind you this man hunts leopards in Africa, Jaguars in South America, Elephant, he's killed a polar bear. My comment to him? Call somebody in Wyoming or canada. Cause we don't have those big Thomas's around here.

[Yaak attack]

Bergman's rule cannot be ignored. While it is true some big cats with big skulls have come from the southwest, the farther you get from the equator the bigger stuff tends to grow. Comparing an Arizona mule deer's body size with deer from Grand prarie Alberta will clear things up in a hurry. I have no doubt that cougar weights are exageated at a higher rate than even bass weights. Many cats continue to grow years after they are dead. When it comes to 200 pound cats, I see a dozen or so every year. Funny thing is they don't have any more hide to them than 130,140 or 150 pouders, imagine that. So the next time anyone out there kills a 200 pounder, be sure and film the weigh in and show the stomach contents (a bag of #7 shot and a funnel will make you famous in a hurry). I certainly don't know everthing about big cougars, but I know a little, and I deal with lion guides, houndsmen and paying dudes for a living, so when someone starts throwing nubers around on a cat that I personally mounted and know for a fact was not weighed, well lets just say the "clown light" starts to flicker a bit.

[Mike Leonard]

Yaak,

I certainly agree with you, I have seen guys post photos of 50 pound bobcats, and un-
officially weighed. I have seen a lot of the same with 600 pound bears , and the proverbial 200 pound cougars. Most of the time the ground shrinkage once you walk up is pretty enlightening. I don't give two hoots and a holler about any of it, or what ya'll think, it has no relivance to me.
But Just like my Dad's 1954 Mule Deer buck from North Dakota that weighed 376 pounds on a railroad scale, and that old lion that weighed 227 on a butcher shop hanging scale sometimes it happens, beleive it or not. Fox News wasn't there however, but it makes no difference. Skinned down to the hocks and hung up next to little old me still about like a nice 3 year old cow elk.

Not the heaviest lion I have heard of and doesn't rank number one in the book, but still a big old boy.

So how many 40 pound plus coons have you'll caught?

[liontracker]

This is the tom that Lionhunterdaves took:

[tntoutfitting]

Sorry guys I typed that in wrong. He was almost 8'3" not eight nine and I might not be measirung him right. Nose to tale before he was caped out was when I measured him.

Openmouth, I have lots of pics and would apprecate the help posting them, that way I could shut up the smart @** in the last couple of posts. "Tntoutfitter, and hounder"

What the hell is "ALMOST" 8'3"? Maybe 8' 2.5" or closer to 3/4" of "ALMOST" that third inch, is 7' 6" ALMOST 8'9" or only "ALMOST" 8'3"? Man 6" shrunk off sorta fast, record books allow some "drying time" but thats excessive shrinkage; you CANNOT put a lion in the dryer on high heat like that!

Thats "ALMOST" more shrinkage then when Ike took an accidental dip in the ice cold river following the Wolf Pack! (now ya gotta forgive me for that one IKE )

Heck I seen a fellow hounder kill a young peanut nutted tom once and when I razzed him just a bit good natured about it he said "well it was ALMOST book"! Holy smokes I bet it was, "ALMOST" a Booner in his books ?

I wasn't making no smart ass comment to you like you so kindly suggest, I got IKE and The Yaakster to pick on, suggest you fling arrows elsewhere than me, and get a camera that takes pictures of the whole deal, your missing "ALMOST" 4'3" of your nice tom in your trophy photo.

Congrats on the catch, sorry if I offended ya with my jabs at my buddy.......

...Hounder, your on your own with this one; prepare to "ALMOST" defend your self

[chilcotin hillbilly]

One thing I have found is that the truly big cats most of my hunters can't hold up for the pictures. Wimpy hunters or just big cats. The cat in the picture was a good tom wieghed #172 with out the guts , the skull squeaked in the book at 15" but that tom only had a 27" tail . Talk about losing a few inches as most of the talis go 34" or better.

[hounder]

Tntoutfitting, I knew this thread was going to be a pissin match from the start i just thought i would throw somethin in there to lighten things up but apparently some one must be a little edgy and thought i was pickin on em almost

[tntoutfitting]

One thing I have found is that the truly big cats most of my hunters can't hold up for the pictures. Wimpy hunters or just big cats. The cat in the picture was a good tom wieghed #172 with out the guts , the skull squeaked in the book at 15" but that tom only had a 27" tail . Talk about losing a few inches as most of the talis go 34" or better.

I agree on the lifting up part CH, but not the 'holding up' part, BUT the way we do it is have 2-3 guides hold the lion up, let the client grab hold as in structed and jump back for a couple quick pics! Most folks, even little gals can "set" themselves locked upright in a leaned back position and hold far more than their own body weight and that looks IMPRESSIVE!

CH you are absolutely correct that few can LIFT a magnum tom up from off the ground for the classic "Heimlick" manuever pose, at least and make the pose look good for pictures!

PS: I dont want to about any of this BS with any one cuz I dont worry to much about it, but I get called an A$$ by that fella and I may just shine the clown light his way........

Nice tom by the way, have taken a bunch of those stub tailed buggers also and your right again they are usually big boys.

[chilcotin hillbilly]

TNT holding it is one thing for sure lifting, it is another thing most of the time I am the only guide and I can't even lift some of them, its a little akward by yourself. Or maybe its my gut that gets in the way.

[tntoutfitting]

Tntoutfitting, I knew this thread was going to be a pissin match from the start i just thought i would throw somethin in there to lighten things up but apparently some one must be a little edgy and thought i was pickin on em almost

Hounder your right on the useless part, interesting stuff what others take and differences in size by area and such as far as lions go, "ALMOST" makes me want to go back and delete my posts so as not appearing to , ......naw I'll just wait a week or two and go back and edit them to "SHRINK" out the negative stuff I stirred up.......ya "ALMOST" two weeks, sorta like the new official 'drying time' !

And I endorse your "lighten up" policy for the crowd here.

[Yaak attack]

Fact is, my dogs, Pertenear, Somewhat and Maybe, Almost treed a cat that woulda' Almost booked. And if they woulda' caught it I think I coulda' shot it and I'm sure I coulda Almost picked it up, or at least Almost half of it's nearly 8'9" of it.
Dave, if the cat in the photo is the nearly 8"3" loin you spoke of then It mus have been one of those Limosine cats, and his body must have extended between the photogrpher's legs and down onto the next bench. Tnt I can't believe the trouble you cause me an ol' Ike.

[BlacktailStalker]

That tnt guy, you'd almost think he just about caught a cat a time or two.
I'm trying to get him to post up pics of the 4' magnum polecat but then a few of these guys might think he almost knows what he's doin' but fact is they DID catch THAT heading back to the truck after almost treeing one of those limo cats Yaak is talkin about.
I believe he had a 68" stride and you could tell it was him from a mile away, because his nut sack was so big, it always dragged in the snow
That woulda been a good story and pics had they actually caught it.
Would have almost been reason to celebrate, coulda thrown the lid to a bottle away and then maybe added 2-20" to the size of that cat the next day and quite possibly, an already impressive limo cat, might have still had a few peolple who almost believe it. Just maybe.