Some people never grow up

Bearkiller · Post by **Bearkiller** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:19 pm

Nothing like driving down a snow covered road with no one but hound hunters out and seeing a trail of beer cans and candy wrappers on the road. Then coming around the corner and seeing them getting ready to turn loose on a small female with kittens. Makes a guys day.

Doogie · Post by **Doogie** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:27 pm

Last time I checked it wasent against the law to turn out on a female with kittens

Bearkiller · Post by **Bearkiller** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:01 am

Hey doogie, I took this from the first page in the Utah cougar proclamation:

Kittens with spots: Under Utah’s cougar
hunting rules, it has always been illegal to pursue or harvest a kitten with spots. The Division has added a definition of “kitten with spots” on
page 36.

Doogie · Post by **Doogie** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:54 am

How am I supposed to know where your hunting if you don't put your location down, here its perfectly legal to persue kittens with spots

How dose that work with ypung juvies? They leave a note beside their track saying that they have spots lol

larry · Post by **larry** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:22 am

Just because it is legal doesn't always mean it is ethical. It is illegal in Ut apparently for a reason :idea:

Would you be raising hell about your right to litter all over the place too if it was legal in your state? Perhaps chasing kittens is something that needs to be brought to the attention of FWP at the regional lion meetings. I would sure hope that you can tell a juvie track from an adult. First thing that crosses my mind when I cut fem. and kits is what would happen if the dogs got ahold of a kit on the ground. Guess you don't give a shit. It's mind boggling that we still have this sport considering some of the participants.

Steve White · Post by **Steve White** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 2:19 am

HMMM, You mu folks must live in a different country. ANywhere I know it is illegal to drink and drive. Suppose empty beer cans does not mean driver was drinking. Even so littering is still illegal. Then to intentionally pursue the young of any game! Guess that is ethics if not illegal in your state. Even so it's just another form of child molestation!!! Kinda folks overall I love to give an old fahsion A** whopping too. Sure it's illegal too, but a jury of my peers will applaud it!!! Will yours???

Doogie · Post by **Doogie** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 2:50 am

Oh now I've done it and pissed off the holyer than thou MT cat hunters lol kittens that are traveling with mom are big enough to climb on there own, if turning out on a female with kittens makes me unethical so be it, its still legal, if its the only track I find I'm turning out on it

So why don't we make presuing bears with cubs, and coons with kits illegal too what the hell, same differance

Never said I was defending the littering

what's it matter if someone has a beer or two outside their truck or one driving down a dirt road, he never said they where drunk

I was trying to lighten the conversation with the young juvy comment sheeeeesh it being Christmas Eve and all, since I had no clue where bearkiller was from

Trackumandtreeum · Post by **Trackumandtreeum** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 3:50 am

In Utah it is illegal to chase sows with cubs. And it is illegal to drink and drive down any road dirt or paved. I just got a call today about a lion that was shot. The deal is the houndsman that treed this cat said it was a tom. The guy shot it and was proud but when it was taken to the dwr it was verified as a female. That sucks but then when it was taken to the taxidermist it was skinned and they found two kittens inside days from being delivered. The problem with all this is that there are houndsmen out there like doogie that just don't care what they chase or what they shoot or what happens around them. Doogie you need to think before you type most these guys on this thread don't think twice about running a female with kittens or a young juvy they would rather wait for a chase that they know is right. I hope next time you are out running and you see a track that has a kitten with it or a small track that you will think twice before running it on the fact that it is unethical.

Brindle · Post by **Brindle** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:02 am

Doogie its guys like you that should have your dogs taken away. This topic comes at a good time. I have been helping a taxidermist and he has had some cats coming in. Thats fine. But the other day he had a guy bring a pregnant female in. I was so damn pissed i couldnt even look at it. You should be able to tell a tom track as apposed to a female track. If you dont then hang up the dogs. So dont even pursue females or kittens let alone kill them. Drive down the gosh damn road and cut a tom. Sorry to vent but this shit is happening all to often. So if you choose to harvest females. Please do us all a favor and hang it up. Same with sows and cubs. Merry Christmas and to all a GOOD night!!

sourdough · Post by **sourdough** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:35 am

Doogie wrote:How am I supposed to know where your hunting if you don't put your location down, here its perfectly legal to persue kittens with spots

How dose that work with ypung juvies? They leave a note beside their track saying that they have spots lol

DUDE! maybe if you are turning out on females with small kitten's you should think about taking up another hobby!

It is people like YOU that give the honest houndsman a bad name to even talk about something like that, and trying to defending it! Really shows your ethic's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

maybe you should look at the regulations for your state, under definitions! http://fwp.mt.gov/hunting/planahunt/lion.html

Read it and you will find what is legal and what is not!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here is a little advice if their track is not as big or bigger than their mother they have spots.........

If it's bigger than a bobcat but not as big as a female lion it more than likely has spots.............

sourdough

dhostetler · Post by **dhostetler** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:50 am

Typically I don't turn on sows with kittens if I figure they are under 60 lb. over 60 lb. they can climb fast any smaller then that and you have fast dogs in deep snow there is a good chance of having dead kittens. Sometimes its hard to tell if you are turning on a sow with kittens if you are turning on a cougar in 2 feet of snow and having nothing for tracks except a trough in powder. I have also already turned on cougars on crusty snow where kittens didn't break through. ( Sometimes its hard to tell)

Doogie · Post by **Doogie** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 5:02 am

Most of these guys think they are better than everyone else too,wich is the whole reason for this thread, why wasent bearkillers first reaction to call the game warden if its illegal in UT then coming on here and bitching about it?

UT and MT are two TOTALY different places, you choose to live there and I choose to live here, you abide by your laws and ill abide by mine

Who said I was shooting these kittens or females with kittens(wich is illegal here) shooting and presuing are two totally different things, sorry, next your gona be saying I shouldent be turning out on females cause they might be pregnant lol (I was right abot that lol)

If its the ONLY track I find all day,untill if they change the law I'm not going to think twice about lettin loose

I've read the regs, maybe you should read the regs, there's not a word in there about it being illegal to CHASE a female with kittens

Brindle · Post by **Brindle** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 5:08 am

What do you do after you catch the female? you probably go back and show all your buddy how good you are and look i can even catch a female wow and I am so good it even had kittens. sweet dude. like i said before hang it up bud. This is our future were talking about your the one that will run and when its gone oh well but us that sand up for it care.

dgarrett · Post by **dgarrett** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:59 pm

Lion hunters are suppose to be able to read tracks and not one of you can even get the story right from the tracks in the story. Its ovious to me that the guy in this story is a newbee. All that litter and beer cans should of been your tip off. Everytime he found a deer, elk, coyote, or any other track crossing the road he had to stop open his door to look at it to see what it was. Beercans just naturally roll towards the door and candy wrappers get blown out by having the heater on high so he could drive down the road with his head out the window and still stay warm. Like every other lion hunter thats found one of there first 20-30 tracks he wasnt thinking about the legality of anything. He was thinking of treeing a lion with his own dogs. I would also say he wasnt wealthy. Or he would have boughten trained dogs for $5000 each and wouldnt have had run an illegal lion just to try to get his dogs going.
Most guys have done thing when they first started hound hunting that they never would do now. Cut the newbee some slack he was just over excited and doing whatever it took to get his dogs going.......JMO dgarrett

Rookie · Post by **Rookie** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:27 pm

Doggie wrote

UT and MT are two TOTALY different places, you choose to live there and I choose to live here, you abide by your laws and ill abide by mine

Im with doggie your bithch should be the drunk litter's not the fact they were going to run there dog's. Thank god for Montana

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