More Hounds Killed By Wolves

[hounddawger]

I tink if a man has an agenda against wolves then a good recorded audio of hounds treeing seem to work really well in attracting them, if wolves are in the area. I read an article in Bugle magazine that showed the numbers of harvest are about the same as they always have been for Elk hunters. This article was in the Sept./Oct. issue. There was a special article about wolves in that issue. It seems like the Rocky Mt. Elk Foundation is on their band wagon. Although they did say that there needs to be management to control the numbers. The bottom line is that their here to stay and houndsmen as a group needs to lobby for protection from Wolves while were enjoying a sport that we love. Hopefully someday we'll get to run a pack of hounds on them S.O.B's. I'm very sorry for anyones loss that they have had. Keep calling and complaining and get pictures of the damage and show them to everyone so that people know what kind of killers the wolves can be.

[Steve White]

Sour- You are right and wrong is some of your words. As we all are!!! Not everyone that hunts hound knows or understands what may lay in wait out there. We all try to bring new folks into this sport, and some have no idea. Don't want to scare them off either. The general public I feel knows, but does not want to know. Pics here and there will serve as a reminder. Then when their dogs get it while on the chain in the backyard. Who's fault is it. Wolf lovers going to use the same problem they created to stop hunting?? Then what? We cant leave our homes because it may hurt a wolf in the yard? Unrealistic? Maybe, but the wolf population in some areas is out of control. Here in WI we have been dealing with it for some time. A simple read of the WDNR website will show some of that. Not all of course, due to the cover ups. In fact a few years one of my local papers. The Lakeland Times. Ran a front page article of a wolf killed beagle. YES, Front page pics of a half eaten beagle!! Yet most still did not think there were even wolves in Northern WI. What do they call that,? Plausible dependability?? I got wolves crossing the road half ile from my house just 100yds from the entrance to a grade school. Yet they do not exsist here. Same thing the parents of the 5yr old in Houghton MI were saying. Until there kid got killed. Yet, that got written off as a hybrid. Then it all got swept under the rug!!

Sure you can say this is not the place for pics. It will do no good here. Well it has to start somewhere. Support in this fight has to come from somewhere. If the folks that visit this site wish to stick there heads in the sand. Then who is going to fight. It has to start somewhere and build. We are all in this together. Everyone needs to know what is going on good or bad. Can't take the harsh reality. Well then it may be best to just get a funny looking mexican dog. Put a dress on it, carry it in a bag while living in the big city. Don't worry though, the way things are going there will be a pack in central park!! Damm I hope so!!!

Sorry about this rant!! I suppose you can see this touches a deep nerve for me!!

[sourdough]

Steve,

You are saying a lot of the same things I am saying. I know that you have had to deal with these none native (NORTHERN) GREY WOLVES for some time. This is healthy debate and I for one thank god that I have not yet had to deal with them, but it is coming. I know that a picture say's a thousand words, but I am glad that they were removed for bullrivers sake.

sourdough

[bullriver]

I wonder if Steve would want to see a hound he raised from a pup in that condition over and over? If you really need to look at the pics to get the idea, I'm sure sourdough could e-mail them to you! Do you really think the wolf lovers and bunny huggers care one bit about our hounds being killed? NO...Those idiots think hounds and hunting dogs are vicious killers, and are glad to see us lose them! I asked Sourdough to remove the pics for obvious reasons and I appreciate him showing his respect in doing so. If you can't understand that then I'm sorry. If , God forbid, something like that ever happens to one of your hounds, you can post the pics if you want. We took those pictures to show to the authorities, not for any kind of entertainment. Houndsmen know what can happen to a dog in this wolf infested country, a picture won't make that any more real for us. I think just the fact that this is becoming more common is what they are really interested in anyway. This post was about the fact that two good dogs were killed needlessly by an animal that we didn't want, and serves no real purpose, except in some environmentalists idea of the west. The pictures, or lack there of don't, change that. Thanks again Sourdough.
Jay

[sourdough]

Bullriver,

I have No pictures of your hound, nor have I ever posted anything like that you may want to check that out before naming someone that did not do such a thing. That would be trakntree that posted the pictures of your dog.

[bullriver]

My mistake..your right thank you! I meant to say that trak n tree took the pics down and you said you were in support of that. Thanks again! And thanks again Trak for removing them.

[Steve White]

Bull was not trying to make light of your loss. I have seen firsthand the aftermath. A picture does not do it justice!! I have been unfortunate to bring the remains out a few times. Fortunate that is has not been my dogs. The term would be lucky I guess. Have been very close. Even with my daughter in the line of fire. Nothing scares you more!!

This is a problem that is going to get much worse. The more info that can be gotten out there in any way has to help in the smallest way each time. As hunters we are on the frontlines of this problem. Since our hands are tied for the most part. The problem is starting to work its way into more suburban areas of WI. More wolves are moving into the southern parts of the state. Going to the larger herds of deer we have left. Although this inot a good thing for those folks, it is good that they are now getting into the areas the bunny huggers live.

The general public still has no clue about what these things are capable of. I would have to think that the majority still believes, or assumes wolves do not attack people. They believe in bigfoot, but not that a wolf can hurt them. Strange!! I had a nice debate with a guy a while back. He was as uninformed as they come. After a bit. I asked him if he would want a serial killer living next door to him. Of course he said NO. I then asked then why do you want one living in the woods behind your house. He said he never though of it that way. Now he is anti wolf.

No that the deer/elk populations are being affected more. These hunters are getting more on board with the fight. Since they are a bit stronger in numbers it will help.


Again sorry for the rant, and if you felt I was down playing your loss. Nobody should ever have to go through it!!!!

[bullriver]

Steve,
I didn't feel you were downplaying anything, I know you feel the same anger and frustration that all of us in this sport do in regards to the wolves. I was only disagreeing with you about the pics of my dog, everything else you are saying is dead on!! Keep fighting!
Jay

[kehrer10]

sorry for your loss. It's gonna be hard to get any simpathy from the good ol fish cops, they deny everything. How many ( too many) wolves are around, just like they denied that there were any griz in the selway until 2 or 3 years ago when that hunter from tenn. or wherever shot one mistaking it for a 600# black bear. We need to push for more accurate numbers on the population to shut up the bunny humpers. Sorry again you even had to go through this, maybe instead of g.p.s. units to find our way back to the truck we need to do like Hansel and Gretel and leave a trail of "bad" meat!

[waylon]

Sorry to hear more hounds being killed, some one has to put a stop to it one way or the other.

IN THE VERY LATE 80'S EARLY 90'S A HYBRID VERSION OF THE RED WOLF, WHICH WAS A MIXTURE OF THE GREY WOLF/COYOTE WAS REINTRODUCED INTO THE MORE RUGGED PARTS OF OKLAHOMA, ONE AREA IN PARTICULAR WAS KNOWN AS THE " BOSTON POOL " AREA OF N.E. OKLAHOMA ALONG THE ARKANSAS RIVER. SEVERAL BREEDING PAIRS WERE RELEASED AND SOON BEGAN TO HAVE A DRAMATIC EFFECT ON LIVE STOCK,PETS & THE DEER POPULATION. THROUGH THE COMBINED EFFORTS OF TIGHT MOUTHED RANCHERS, PEOPLE LIVING ALONG THE AREA EFFECTED,LOCAL TRAPPERS AND A FEW ROUGE HOUNDSMEN MAINLY COYOTE HUNTERS ( WE CALL'EM WOLF HUNTERS AROUND HERE AND ALWAYS HAVE ) THE BREEDING PAIRS WERE QUICKLY AND QUIETLY REMOVED, THE GREAT AND MIGHTY OKLAHOMA WILD LIFE DEPARTMENT AFTER FIRST DENYING THERE RELEASE OR EXISTENCE ATTEMPTED TO LOCATE AND ARREST RUMORED WOLF KILLERS. THERE EFFORTS FAILED AND THEY NOW HAVE A PERMANENT BLACK EYE WITH ALL THE PEOPLE OF THAT AREA.BUT TO THIS DAY THE LIVE WOLF FREE

I RAMBLED ALL OF THAT OUT TO SAY THIS, GOOD PEOPLE WILL HAVE TO STAND UP AND FORCE THE GOVERMENTS HAND ON THE WOLF ISSUE, IN MONTANA, OR ANY WHERE ELSE. WRITING YOUR POLITICIANS IS A GOOD IDEA, BUT " QUICKLY AND QUIETLY " WORKING BEHIND THE SCENE SURE SPEEDS THINGS ALONG. IT'S NO DIFFERENT THAN GOVERMENT RUNNING AMUCK IN ANY OTHER AREA, IT'S THE COMMAN PEOPLE DOING UNCOMMON TASK WHO HAVE ALWAYS HAD TO CLEAN HOUSE AND CLEAN UP THE MESS THESE GOVERMENT OFFICALS MADE.GOOD LUCK, AND I AM SORRY TO HEAR THAT AGAIN

[newby]

Bullriver, sorry to hear about your hounds...it always hurts to hear about a hound getting killed while doing his job, especially in such a senseless fashion. I'm new to Montana and have been following this whole wolf debate loosely from a distance since it began, but now being in their backyard has me wanting to be a little more educated.

I've heard that the wolves they introduced were a different species then the native population they were supposed to be "reintroducing" and that was the basis for making said reintroduction illegal, however, when I search the wolf debate online all I find is that they have reintroduced the Northern Gray Wolf and that this was it's home territory. The literature says that this is the same species that once roamed these mountains long ago. I was confused, so I asked a friend who is a wildlife biologist (also a hunter) what the deal is and he also said they're the same species and had been migrating across the Canadian border for years. Can someone help bring some clarity to this issue for me: weblinks, articles, etc...

Thanks! Again, my condolences to all who have lost dogs to these wolves. Guess the real question is, and I know I'm not the only one who has asked it, but, what can we do to put a stop to these killings of our dogs without further polarizing ourselves from the rest of the sane public? Sure popping a wolf will give immediate gratification and a feeling of vengeance, but is it going to stop the majority of these killings? Don't know, but my gut says that we're going to have to make it hurt the federal pocketbook somehow before this will be at least slowed down.

[majestic mccoy]

man so many hounds taken by them.I was told could not shoot them because we were in there territory. Our fore fathers got them out of here for a reason. Sorry for your loss.

[bullriver]

How many times are we gonna read about this till something is done... Whoever needs these stories to educate feel free!

[bpo]

bullriver, thanks for allowing use of your story, I didn't see the photos, are they available?

If I can get enough info regarding attacks on dogs, I want to add a page specifically for dog attacks by wolves:

http://graywolfnews.com

Thanks, Again

[bullriver]

BPO
I don't have the photos...I think they were put on my post on the UKC message boards forum. It's on the big game hunting section. There is another story on my post as well, and the pics of that one are there also.
Jay