hoghunters

[PLOTTMAN55]

I have never really hunted a cur before on hog i have always hunted plotts i have been wanting to try kemmer cur or a black mouth cur i was wanting ever one to pick wich one u think is better for hogs and why i no there are good dogs in ever breed but just tell me witch one u think is the best for hogs and is most grittest.

[Pops]

kemmers have been bred by "exhoundsmen" mostly and hunt more like a hound than BMCs do (except mybe Ladner dogs). i don't feel confident in hounds or mt curs in general to stop a bad hog, run him to exhaustion sure but actually pull him up nope, no confidence.
BMCs OTH i feel very confident in (except ladner dogs) stopping them. most won't run as cold a track as a hound or even a kemmer mt cur. but then you also less likely to have to cross two properties to get to where the hog is bayed.
all of that said i haven't hunted w/ a lot of mt curs of any line and may be basing my opinion on too few experiences.

[bigboarstopper]

As for the 2 different breeds you picked. I have to say black mouth is far more gritty. However I (personally) think the kemmer generally has a better nose than the black mouth. While I have never owned a pure blackmouth, I have hunted with many. They are pretty comprable to the catahoula in range and grittyness.

As for the most gritty hog dogs. Not including catchdogs. The grittyest ones I have ever seen have been airedale crosses. (mabye a little too gritty) Most, if not all of them required running vests and cut collars. Their range seems to be shorter. Most of the guys ive seen who run these crosses have a longer range dog that will do most of the track work but the airedale crosses close the gap pretty quick and put the brakes on em.

In regards to the best for hog hunting. My personal opinion would be cur crosses in general. In my own experience pure catahoulas, blackmouths, ect dont put enough pressure on a dog smart boar to stop. The hogs in my neck of the woods have seen the dogs before or have been tought by other hogs to flat out run when the dogs show up. Rarely do the hogs allow to be bayed anymore. We also have smaller properties where I hunt so allowing a hog to run a miles pushes the property limits a times.

Its almost impossible to pick a best breed for me. Hog dogs and their usual breeds have really never shown much consistancy in how they hunt in my experience. One blackmouth would be pretty gritty while the other would bay from 20 feet back. One catahoula would range well outside the others while another was really short. I honestly can say that I know very very few people who own a pure anything when it comes to hog dogs. Including myself.

To sum it up. Airedale crosses have been the most gritty in what Ive come across over the years. Almost to a fault. The best all around dogs have always been cur crosses for me. Pure catahoulas and the like all have their possitives but have always fallen short of an all around dog in my experience. My current lead dog is a catahoula/kemmer x. JMO.

[MOHOOKER]

I have never hunted a pure, blackmouth, but i have hunted crossed, and like bawl said, most good hog dogs are crossed. My pack right now is a 4 pack, with 2 catahoulas, ! OMC, and 1 Catahoula OMC cross. My catch dog, is one of the pure catahoulas, for a cat he is very big muscled up, about 90lb, very gritty, on hogs. My OMC is a very wide dog, very good nose, and lots of drive. but the thing he lacks is stoping power. Smaller hogs(120lb) no problem, has a rough time with the bigger ones. But getting a good pack that works together is key. I can catch most hogs around with just the 2 dogs iv been talking about, the other 2 are very loyal hunting dogs, but i wouldnt take them 2 to the woods by them selves, but mix them in with the other 2, and they shine. Lost of stopping power that can turn a rank hog.
So its mostly like everything else, some dogs work some dont, weed out the ones that dont hunt the way you want to. On another note, i feel you need diff types of dogs also, I really like my catch dog to lay back, nice and fresh when you need him.

[coadycurbow]

We don't have as many hogs as we used to due to an increased number of hunters. 15 years ago we would walk in with a mutt that would bark at a hog and bay the whole heard. Now with lower numbers and the fact that they run, we have changed our methods. We use cold-nosed plotts to strike the hog, then turn Black mouth curs to em.

Sometimes the Plotts bay em. Sometimes the curs stop em. Sometimes we have an all day race. Big hogs usually stand and fight. The ones we hate are 100 lb boars that can run all day.

Where did your plotts come from?

[jkcasey]

Pops, when you say that the "exhoundsmen" had alot to do with the kemmer, were they houndsmen looking for something in a dog that the could not get in a hound, or were they looking to put more of the traits they liked of a hound in the cur breed? Later Kiel

[Pops]

i think for the most part they were houndsmen getting older & having their grounds getting smaller so they gravitated toward curs w/ their rep for warmer noses, shorter ranges & faster catches. then they bred them to be more like the hounds they used to run, especially more mouth.

[flea573]

Most of the stuff on here about Blackmouths is far from being accurate , some lines are going to be rougher ,I have had some that were straight catch dogs , some that bayed tight and in the hogs face , and some that bayed windmill like they was workin cows ,you just have to find the kind of dog you like ,but never had any problems with them stopping hogs I have been hunting the same strain for 15 years ,been around blackmouths my whole life I have had dogs from almost every line of BMC out there .There is a line for just about every one .The longer I hunt and learn about hogs the less rough a dog I want ,pressure aint always a good thing i wouldrather have a dog that bays loose not a creeper thats always looking to get in a hogs face or always looking to find a way to get teeth on a hog . A hog will settle down if a dog dont pressure him , a dog smart or a hog that hasent ever seen dogs ,hearing all the stuff about needing rough dogs ,gives me a good laugh a dog that will stop a running hog then back off and bay will live longer ,hold hogs longer ,and not get your other dogs cut up and catch more hogs , these are words of knowledge from chasin hogs in the mountains of NC the thickets of SO Texas ,East Texas ,Georgia ,Arkansas Oklahoma and Missouri with the Missouri hogs being the hardest to hunt .I have tried all kinds of dogs ,these BMC dogs will get it done .Most people who say otherwise have only been around a couple or dogs that are mutts that are yellow and get called bmc . There has to be a reason why more serious hunters use them them than any other dog breed.

[jkcasey]

Good info from all post. In short, hunt the best you can afford that suit you. Thanks for all the info guys. Later Kiel

[coadycurbow]

Flea, I agree with you. I like a dog that will get rough enough to stop the hog and then get back and bay. There is a fine line between rough enough and too rough. The dogs that will never "try" a hog, won't get him stopped here. Also, the dogs that get too aggressive with the hog, will push him further.

I'm beginning to believe that the time of year has a lot to do with running hogs. Right after deer season they are fat on acorns and corn and are not as bad to run. In the summer months when food is harder to find it seems like nearly all of em run.

Lately it seems we bay more with one or two good dogs instead of using a whole pack. How many dogs do Ya'll try to use at a time?

[jkcasey]

I like two. It's easier to handle two when I'm by myself, which is most of the time.

[flea573]

two good dogs and maybe a pup or 2 thats coming up

[coadycurbow]

What age do yall start your pups? Our line don't seem to mature until around 18 months. We start carrying them at about a year, but the second season seems to be about the time we can tell which is an all-star.

[Pops]

i think a lot of people spemd time chasing hogs BECAUSE they run too many dogs

[bigboarstopper]

Most of the time were running 4 dogs and leading 1 or 2 catch. Ive killed hogs with a dog or two but 4 or more is the norm.

As for running dogs, The number of dogs dosent matter in my opinion. Wether it be 2 dogs or 10 the result has been usually the same for me. That hog gets bayed by a single dog hes running. He knows the cavalry is comming and he dosent care if the cavalry is one more dog or 20 more dogs hes running.

I believe the hogs will really dictate what kind of dogs you need to run in your area. Certain hogs in certain areas will do completely different things than hogs in another area. Where I hunt the hogs tend to be larger and exceptionally tall. They will run right through a 4 dog bay and dont stop when their hair is getting pulled or not.

Most of the time around here the hogs will run at the first bark. There are a few places where ive hunted where the hogs will bay quite easily without running. Most of the time its because these places have hogs that have never or rarely seen the dogs. Ive also hunted a few places where the dogs will bay small herds in the teens and the hogs will hold.

I remember a place where we hunted and the dogs would bay a hog and the herd would watch 50yds away. We would kill that hog and bay another out of the herd and the process would repeat itself. We killed 7 before the hogs decided they had watched enough and took off.

The days where we would kill one after the other have become less and less frequent. The hog population has thined a bit and the hunting pressure has gone up on the hogs that are still around. I think if our winter can produce some herds in groups of 20's and 30's then they will become more bold as they were back in our flood years. You could bay a hog easly with one dog or a big pack. Back then you could drive some country roads and see numerous herds. Sometimes 50+. The biggest herd I ever saw was over a hundred before I quit counting.

Now days the hogs are in much smaller groups. Usually a hand full, singles or pairs. I havent seen a herd over 15 in quite some time. They are super skiddish and dont even run away as a group like they did before. They frantically run in all directions and almost never stand their ground anymore.

I hunt with a few guys who have really rough dogs and other guys who have bay dogs. The guys with the rougher dogs are catching more hogs at shorter ranges but the dogs are certainly paying for it. The guys with the baying dogs strike hogs more often or sooner than the rough ones but the race can get beyond what we can cover on foot and we either get the hog after a long race or sleep in a bush until the dogs come back. My dogs tend to be more agressive if they see other dogs catching. They tend to test the waters on a hog when running with more bay or passive dogs.

Im not gonna say that "these are my words of knowledge" and "only serious hunters" hunt this or that particular breed or try to disregard anybody elses method but my thought on all of it has always been the same. Its about having a dog that has a balance of range and roughness for your particular style of race.