Deep Dry Snow....

[Daniel Tremblay]

So I went for a drive after work yesterday in search for a track, It has been below freezing for a couple days now. It was 8 degrees at 8:48 last night and dusting a new skiff of snow on top of the 12-30 inchs of existing fluffy powder. Obviously not the best conditions for laying a good track. All I managed to dig up was trash and one lion track. (Gotta love Oregon since we cant run em). Anyways I was wondering how you guys deal with these circumstances and how your time/track and track/tree ratios are when conditions are like this?

[twist]

As for the deep dry snow in our area it makes it crappy to identify tracks for the hunter but for the dogs it should make it way easier for them to track any time the cat is draging in the snow there is just that much more scent, this makes for good hard and fast races.

[PIGLET]

In my experience there is nothing worse! You could swear to god that track looks 5 minutes old and the dogs will look at you and and laugh! in my opionion the dry snow leaves very little scent, and real cold weather makes that track look so good!

[cat and bear]

Yep, dry deep snow is tough, I've watched the dogs put their heads deep to even get scent, it doesnt hold much. That is a good time when the old dog, cheats and follows tracks until it get into other game to cover ground Thats when knowing the stride of a bobcat really helps, or the tracking will be real slow in deer and coyotes, its tough .

[twist]

When we get snow here that is pretty much all it is (cold,dry and fluffy) the only time we really ever get a wet snow is late winter early spring if the dogs couldnt run in it and move a track we wouldnt catch very many cats. This is in our area as it shows different areas different outcomes. When we just get a dusting of this snow that is when it is the hardest tracking for the hounds and the deeper it getts the faster they can move it in this part of the country unless we are talking major deep snow then it gets to be a plowing race.

[Daniel Tremblay]

I agree, it makes it very hard to I.d. the track especially when you can't blow the fresh dust out because you have a mouth full of stiches from getting ur smart teeth out
Its suppose to snow again this weekend and warm up to just below freezing, so hopefully things will get better.

[Mel White]

hey twist i bet you really have to be on your toes in that deep fluffy stuff to make sure it isnt a wolf.(when you are looking for a lion track). im paranoid of that. dont have them here yet but i know when i go east i walk the tracks out into the timber or under a bush or something just to verify.im sure people have turned out on wolves before on accident, hopefully i never will.

[cat and bear]

Its interesting how things look and hunting conditions for different folks and area's,I never had to worry if its a wolf or lion track The stride to me is the best, seems here, with the fluffy stuff, the snow falls back in and other then stride, you would go crazy trying to figure it out. If really in doubt, I will walk it until it crosses a log or under some tree's, so you can see the print or stride better, and a bobcat will step on a log everytime. LOL

[david]

i walk the tracks out into the timber or under a bush or something just to verify.

[,quote="Daniel Tremblay"]I agree, it makes it very hard to I.d. the track especially when you can't blow the fresh dust out because you have a mouth full of stiches from getting ur smart teeth out
.

I will walk it until it crosses a log or under some tree's, so you can see the print or stride better, and a bobcat will step on a log everytime. LOL

.[/quote]

Wow, I sure messed up my attempts to quote three different people, sorry to all, I dont think it came out right for who said what. I hope I dont get sued or something.

Anyway, point is, I have sure spent a lot of time walking tracks out when I had a number one reliable old dog sitting in the dog box that could have told me exactly what that track was in the few seconds that it took me to let her out of the box. (phew, hows that for a run on sentance ha ha. Yes, I did go to high school, but I missed that day.)

I dont know why it took me so long to figure that out. I have also sat and shook my head watching super experienced cat men doing the same thing. I have seen them waste as much as a haklf hour walking out a track looking for that spot where it would be clear and clean. At the time, they had a dog sitting in the box that could not be bought and would not run a wolf or a coyote or even pause at a track of one of them.

We all have times when we are without an old reliable. But if you have one, dont forget about her. She sure will save you a ton of time!

For you new hunters: some dogs have VERY distinctive body language when they are breathing in bobcat scent. If you learn their tail and body movement on bobcat, you can use them for track ID even before they are broke and reliable. They will tell on themselves in a big way if it is something other than bobcat. A dog like this is worth keeping around even if that is the only thing they do well, until you got something reliable. These dogs are also easier to break , because you know when it is trash.

[johnnyrick1981]

david, not to ruffle feathers but there are many reasons to get a good look at the footprint, even knowing what it is. Those experienced cat guy's are basing decisions on that print.

[david]

david, not to ruffle feathers but there are many reasons to get a good look at the footprint, even knowing what it is. Those experienced cat guy's are basing decisions on that print.

Ya, I probably did not present my case in the best way. There are a lot of reasons for fighting for a nice clean look at the track. I should not judge other folks' reasons for doing it. Here's mine: 1) I just like looking at them. I get an adrenalin rush the same way a dog does when he smells one. 2)I dont have a dog that I completely trust with me that day. 3) I dont have a dog that I trust very well. 4) I have a young dog that is not trustworthy yet. 5) I have a dog that I can trust sometimes and I am not sure if this is one of those times. 6) I have a dog that I can usually trust, but I would just like to see that track, you know, just for old times sake. 7) I dont have a dog that I trust with me that day.

I am not sure what those experienced guys are needing to decide by seeing that cat track clearly. But pretty much everything I need to decide can be decided by a good dog that I trust. Not only can the dog tell me instantly that it is a cat track that she can smell and work, but she also can tell me instantly if it is a cat track she can smell and work. Even if I waste fifteen minutes or more getting a clean look at the track, I still dont know for sure if it is something the old girl can work, and I already got my house slippers full of snow.

I have probably walked out as many tracks as the next guy, and I probably have had more years than the next guy when I was starting a young dog without the help of a finished dog. I sure do recomend a positive ID for that. But IF I have a tried, true, and reliable dog, I have learned that I sure can save a lot of time by taking her out of the box for a few seconds. She is an expert at track ID; better than a computer or even an experienced cat man.

[cat and bear]

David, you said a mouth full, A dog you can trust, will tell you and they decide if they can handle it, the rest is pure entertainment for us to walk, like you said, i think maybe gets us pumped a little before we turn loose. Especially on a big old track. Heck, sometimes, looking at a zillion deer and coyote tracks, even they start to resemble a cats stride, or you hope so If in doubt, I turn old willy down, and a few steps, he comes back to the truck, and jumps on the tailgate, and looks at me like boss, wish I had a shocking collar on you, your trying to trash again

[david]

I was going to share a helpful hint for the new guys, and maybe even an old guy or two that I have hunted with and frustrated me no end. When you are hunting snow that is dry and hard to ID, here is something I do, that again, saves time. Most guys will not do it because you gotta get off your duff to do it, but I guarantee it will help speed up track ID under certain conditions. It is from a book called "Hunting Bobcats and Jesus with Dogs"

When you are approaching a track coming across the road that looks like it has cat potential, stop your vehicle well before you get to the track. Get out of the truck, and walk up to it to study it in the road before tampering with the evidence with your rig.

Very often the clear print you are looking for was in the road before you messed it up with the truck. Even if there was a clear print on the berm, the action of the truck can blow that dry snow into it. But often, there never was a clear print anywhere but in the road. The tracks you do not completely wipe out with the tires, will be blown in by the movement of the truck.

Often, you can get a better attempt at aging the track also. If there are old tire tracks with some snow in them, this is where you will get your best print, and age. MOst of the time, the cat will put down in that tire track. IF it shows up in the new skiff of snow, obviously, he walked since the snow, and the track will be pretty like a picture. If the stride shows him stepping in the tire track but the track is missing, well there is some more info about time. He walked before the skiff of snow fell.

IF there is no new snow and his stride puts him in the tire track, and there is no track there, look again! You gotta go from seeing a mess in a bunch of snow to seeing almost invisible outline on a hard surface. Often though, once you get your eyes changed over, you will see the very certain outline of the feline, complete with the "w" in the heel.

If there is a tire track there, and the bobcat stride does not recognize the tire track at all, the other truck probably came through since the cat walked. They were deer hunting or blind guys cat hunting.


All this will be lost in dry snow if you do not stop the truck befor you get to the track

If in doubt, I turn old willy down, and a few steps, he comes back to the truck, and jumps on the tailgate, and looks at me like boss, wish I had a shocking collar on you, your trying to trash again

Man do I ever know that look Those dogs are so much better at this than I am. If you got a dog like that, forget about the above helpful hint. you wont need it

Again, for the new guy: When I am trying to get a young dog to that point, I take him out of the box often to check out all kinds of tracks. It is not really fair to a dog if the only time he gets out of the box is for a bobcat track. They can not learn discernment. What if the last ten tracks you took them out of the box for were rip roaring good timing, full speed ahead bobcat tracks? Then the eleventh track is an unidentified coyote track. Guess what, it will be a rip roaring good timing, full speed ahead coyote track. But If two out of the last ten were bobcat tracks, the young dog will understand some sense of responsibility when he is taken out of the box.

[NorWester]

David wrote,

But If two out of the last ten were bobcat tracks, the young dog will understand some sense of responsibility when he is taken out of the box.

..... I need some dogs just like that ....... not the irresponsible, delinquent buggars I keep.
To be truthful I'd be pleased as punch if my own children understood some sense of responsibility, never mind the dogs.
Of course, they have it tough I suppose, seeing as how their role model hasn't figured out that much yet either

[twist]

David, you are sure right about having a true check dog that makes it alot easier but most of the time I never have any of those type of dogs The reason I said what I said about ID the track gets pretty hard to do in deep snow is because the way I have learned to hunt in my area is what I call (cheating the system) or maybe just wiser with age! I will narrow my bobcat track down before turning out on it as I have hunted the same private ground for 25+ yrs and have found if I can help my dogs as much as possible my catch rate goes up and rather than turning out and catching one cat per day I may get luck enough to put on another one or two the same day, I am fortunate to be able to do this. so if I were to turn out my hound to help me ID a track in deep snow he or she may be in for a longer race than if I can cut roads and ridges and narrow it down. As for what you were saying a great check dogs is worth thier weight in gold if you have them and are commited to walking from the point you find the track. later,Andy