Wolves delisted

[onegreen]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25741975
Thought you guys out west would want to see this BS!

[yotabluewalker]

we have a healthy population here in the Bitterroot as my son will attest to .They ate his female cur this winter while she was on a lion track. we spend more money on wolf patrol before turning out then anything else.They have no fear of humans or our dogs. i would be interested to hear from others hunting wolfcountry with ideas of deterents/dog protection

[kirpa]

Hello

This is the medicine we have found for dealing wolf problems.

http://www.hannuhuttu.com/gallery/displ ... =12&pos=57

It's risky but it works. Eastern Finland has lots of problems with wolves taking hunting dogs. Last winter guys took few walkers out and hunted some single wolves. Hope this plants some human fear to wolves and make them fear of barking dogs. Time will tell...

[nmplott]

next time take a dog with parvo out there and let them feast on it

[yotabluewalker]

thanks Kirpa.......very nice site! I have heard the houndsmen in Canada use bigger hounds in larger packs, also use bells on collars. We are not legally allowed to chase/kill wolves with dogs here, nor legally allowed to protect our hunting dogs, however the law allows for killing in order to protect myself so ..................Wolves definetely affect the way we lion hunt and has changed the type of dog most guys use. Our houndclub is supporting a proposal to be able to hunt them thru the end of December at least, because we as houndsmen see them more than the boot hunters and if shots ever get to be fired they will become tougher to get anyway. The biologists do not want them hunted any later than November 30, so they have plenty of time to get back into family groups to breed. Well WAH! They will become even more secretive so I fail to see how we willl kill them all in one season.

[yotabluewalker]

nmplott.. you voice the same opinion of many however i do not want to jeopardize my hunting by purposefully doing something unethical and probalby illegal( cruelty to animals or some dumb charge) Thank you for your resonse though

[TomJr]

We don't have wolves here, yet thank god! However I was wandering if anyone has thought about trying to bring back some of the larger hunting breeds like Irish wolfhounds. Though I don't realy think the Irish wolfhound of today is the same animal as the Hunting Irish wolfhound. The breed was basicly lost and has been "reconstructed" and is more of a show/pet now.



Following Quote taken from wikipedia

While many modern texts state Irish Wolfhounds were used for coursing deer, contemporary pre-revival accounts such as Animated Nature (1796) by Oliver Goldsmith are explicit that the original animal was a very poor coursing dog. Their astonishing size, speed, and intelligence made them ideal animals for both boar hunting and wolf hunting, and many were exported for this purpose. They were perhaps too ideal, as the boar and wolf are now extinct in Ireland. The Irish Wolfhound has been recorded as being exhibited in ancient Rome to some excitement, and mention is made that they so amazed and terrified the Romans that it was seen fit to only transport them in cages. There exist stories that in the arena, the original Wolfhound was the equal of a lion. It has also been shown that when hunting animals, the wolfhound would bite the neck and crush the spine, killing the creature.

During times of conflict with England, it was not uncommon for Wolfhounds to be trained to take armoured knights off of their horses, thus allowing an infantry man to move in and finish the kill if the Wolfhound had not done so already.

Due to a massive export into various countries as a gift for royalty and a ban that allowed only royalty to own such a dog, the breed almost vanished in the middle of the 19th century. Captain Graham rebred the Irish Wolfhound with the Deerhound, Great Dane, Borzoi and other breeds; this saved the breed, but had the inevitable effect of altering its appearance, most noticeably leaving the Irish Wolfhound with alternative colours such as brindle (inherited from the Great Dane) as before they were mainly grey in colour.


The ancient breed (often referred to as the Irish Wolfdogge in contemporary accounts) was available in both a smooth and rough coated variety. Descriptions of its appearance and demeanor, as well as the method of its use place it closer to the flock guardians in appearance than the modern breed. It is clear that the dog was not always the giant of today and it has been suggested that the Wolfhound was part of the make up of the Kerry Blue Terrier. The historical variety was famed for its loyalty, discernment, grave nature and aggression. In terms of temperament the modern breed has been greatly mellowed.[citation needed] Wolfhounds are often referred to as "Gentle Giants", and a historic motto of the breed is "Gentle when stroked. Fierce when provoked."

Taken from wikipedia wolf hunting.

Borzoi
The Borzoi is a sighthound of Russian origin, thought to trace itself back to the 13th century. Until the abolition of serfdom in 1861, the Borzoi was used almost exclusively by the nobility. When embarking on a wolf hunt, the duke would usually take three hounds - two dogs and a bitch, which would be restrained on short leads. The Borzois would usually be accompanied by Foxhounds, whose job was to flush out the wolf. Once the wolf was driven from its lair, the Borzois would be released. The Borzois would run alongside the wolf and harass it. Once the wolf lost its balance and fell, it was immediately grabbed at the ears and throat and held down by the three dogs. The hunters then rode up and bound its legs and wedged a wooden block between its teeth. These wolf hunts lasted about an hour each and any young healthy wolves would then be released again.[52]


[edit] Irish Wolfhound
The Irish Wolfhound is an ancient sighthound originally bred by the Celts to hunt large game, including wolves. Unlike the Borzoi, the Irish wolfhound was bred not just to track and chase down wolves, but to directly kill them, shaking their quarry till their necks broke.[53] After the Cromwellian conquest of Ireland, wolves were considered such a threat that a ban was imposed on the export of Irish wolfhounds so that the problem of wolves in Ireland could be tackled.[7] By the later part of the 19th century when wolves had by then been completely exterminated in Ireland, the wolfhounds very nearly became extinct.[53]


[edit] Greyhound crosses
Wolf hunting Greyhound crossbreeds were a personal favourite of Theodore Roosevelt who wrote that exclusively purebreed greyhounds were unnecessary, sometimes to the point of uselessness in a wolf hunt. Some bulldog blood in the dogs was considered helpful, though not essential. Nevertheless, Roosevelt wrote that no two greyhounds or deer-hounds were a match for a wolf, stating that it was preferable for a dozen or so dogs to be released simultaneously on the wolf, though he did mention it was possible for two or three veteran hounds of the greatest courage to kill a wolf unaided. Greyhounds were usually used in unison with scent hounds and large mongrels. The greyhounds would pursue and surround the wolf after the scent hounds had tracked it. They would then wait for the larger dogs to attack the wolf before going in for the kill themselves. Some hunters preferred the smooth greyhound, because of its great speed, and others the wire-coated animal, the rough deer-hound, because of its superior strength.[41]

But if the breed was created once maybe another simular breed could be formed to deal with wolves on a more even footing ie size but still keeping agility. The Irish wolf hound didn't have a super nose either... was more of a sighthound. Just something to think about since the wolves are not going to just go away and its either learn new ways to run hounds in those areas or keep losing dogs to the wolves. I am not saying use dogs to chase wolves but it would be nice to have some larger dogs in the pack that can take a wolf out if it comes to that

[ALEX]

I think the idea of houndsmen running majestics in wolf country over regular hounds is a good idea. Obviously because majestics are larger and stronger and match up better to a wolfs size and strength and also could defend themselves better if they needed to. But even so, isnt it true that when wolves do kill hounds its usually the entire pack that comes and goes after the hounds and not just one single wolf that does it? So even running bigger dogs may not solve the problem completely because even a small pack of extremely strong and large hounds couldn't take on an entire wolf pack.

[yotabluewalker]

it was just one pair that ate our dog, a collared female and her mate. Our female was running the track with our big male bluetick/walker cross(80lbs). She was very choppy which only helps the wolves to zone in faster.our male runs quiet on the track until he's right on top of game. The tracks in the snow showed she was behind our male and the two wolves ambushed her from two different sides. Wolves have changed the type of dog we run form 5-6 years ago. faster, hot-nosed dogs who run quieter are where we are which takes away from being able to listen to the chase and enjoying a coldnosed dog working out the older tracks.
some of us have discussed using bigger dogs and more of them but so far we are just in the research phase.

[kirpa]

We have same kind of problems here too. We use spits to hunt moose or upland birds and wolves attacks when dogs chop hard and loud. Also hound are gone in the middle of the race right beside of the owner. Some Wolves are so used to human that they attack and eat dogs at yard.
There are some el.vest for the dogs but noone have proved that it would really work when wolf attacks.
http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sivu213kw.jpg
Wolves use to attack on the rear side of dogs, thats how they knock down they prey and then aim to throat. Spike collard would help a little bit but when there are several wolves one dog got no change without a rifle.
In Russian they still use Borzoi hound to wolf hunting its as big as irish but some of those still got it what it takes to hunt wolves. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTPvtga-Rgs.

Or the old Finnish reindeer sheppard trick is to shoot wolf in to stomack so it will run at least ten miles. Then local police can't track down the shooter.

[Hunter]

I hate it for you guys. I hate to loose a dog to a bear or hog but in those cases you can sometimes get justification. So to speak. Your dogs were doing what they were meant to do and just caught a stroke of bad luck. Where as with a damned ole wolf your hands are tied. We have talked about this in our group of guys. One man says that the government should pay loose of the dogs or vet bills just like they do in livestock. My thing with that is these people have deep pockets and don't care. Another guy says use the S.S.S. method. Shoot, shovel, shutup. Works but, has it's down sides as well...like jail time if caught. I ain't going to be bubba's babe for shooting a wolf. What about hazing them like they do with problem bears in New Jersey...you know that bear loving state that would prefer you not even look at their bears. I don't know if there is a real salution until ya'll can hunt them and put the fear of man and dogs in them. Good luck and I hope ya'll don't loose any dogs to them.

[yotabluewalker]

I'm very impressed with the vest, similar to the kevlars i've seen on hog dogs.how are they in the brush as far as hang ups?
since the judge is against the hunting proposals, what a surprise, i guess we will use this next season to experiment. i thought we had enough pups to train however i would be interested if someone has pups or or knows a line used for "wolf /coyote protection" i'm not familiar with sight dogs but am always willing to learn new tricks.

[three rivers catahoulas]

I would think the dogs would be fine, as far as the over heatin goes in the winter or fall up there. A bay vest would probly help the dog out in a dog fight, if any thing a cut collar would be good to. I dont know them wolves are pretty big and have alot more killin drive then a demestic dog. I used to elk hunt on the Locksaw River, I like that country. To bad there throwin it to the dogs & Griz. I dont know if I read this right a few months back, but Idaho Fish & Game killed a wolf in Headquaters Idaho that weighed over 150 lbs and you could put a dallor bill in his track, thats a big dog, A bulldog wouldn't have a chance with a dog that big, let alone two or more. I guess it's back to SSS

[yotabluewalker]

i'm not sure that a new thread for hunting in wolf country shouldn't be started but since i'm new i will continue with this one...i've researched irish wolfhounds and apparently it takes a butt kissin to the IW club which i'm pretty sure is anti-hunting with these dogs. not sure were else to look. anybody have wolf dogs ? i hate to order them from overseas i could buy a new toyota and 220 swift for that kinda money... where do i research gear for my dogs to wear. i have a nice bluetick/walker bitch that i'm considering breeding next spring... was wanting to stay with lighter dog-up to 60 pounds, she's 55 lbs, but maybe some advice about the majestics as mentioned earlier. i've seen some canadian dogs and they appear to be as big as wolves. i foresee wolves encompassing more hunting territory and am very interested in experimenting with breeds suited for the job ahead.

[three rivers catahoulas]

Yota,
PM me the measurements of your dogs, my wife builds all of our cut vests and cut collars. A bay vest would be good for your hounds, my Walkers and Plott's wear'em while huntin hogs. Just a one or two layer vest would be tougher then just skin. You mesure around there neck, from the middle of there neck to the last rib & around there chest. And for a collar mesure around there neck and add 2 inches.